"Geo" wrote in message
...

Hi Jenny,
Your highrise greenhouse is great and being a little closer to the sun
is no bad thing
I`ve posted a picture of the greenhouse during construction so you`ll
have an idea what it may look like once i get it finished.
http://tinyurl.com/3td9h

WOW - shades of the Eden project :~)

As for the aquaponics, i have a little experiment going on with some
chillies to test the theory out and so far its looking good but i`m
running out of space rapidly.
All they have to grow in is fishwater and they have been in that since
they germinated.
They were pretty tiny as you can see from the pics:
http://tinyurl.com/5lpyj
The big picture was taken on 16th march and the tallest are about 13"
http://tinyurl.com/4pj5z
The droopy leaves are due to the cold night temperature i think, as
they pick up in the day when it gets warmer.
This is my first attempt at growing chillies by any method so i`m not
sure what they need but they seem to be doing fine so far
Geo

Interesting concept. I know about hydroponics but had not heard about
aquaponics.
It seems like you might need lots of fish to produce enough waste matter to feed
the plants.
What's the fish per cubic metre water ratio ?

Jenny

Hi Jenny,
Hydroponics is the same except for the nutrients.
With aquaponics you just need to feed the fish and top up the water levels.

With normal hydroponics you have to mix the nutrients and change the solution every few weeks, so you have to pour the water somewhere.

I prefer the feeding the fish and topping up the water option plus its organic

The fish to water ratio is about 1.6" of fish to 4.5 ltrs of water.
I will probably have a lot more in the actual greenhouse system.
All the fish are quite large from 200mm to 350mm.

The experiment uses 20 ltrs in a tub with 5 chilli plants to test how much nitrate is used in a week, so far the it`s hardly measurable.

I took some new pics yesterday to keep the album updated:
http://usera.imagecave.com/Geo/Greenhouse/

The plants are deep green (except where the camera flash is) and have begun to show flower stems (like pods?)

I`ve not grown chillies before so i`ve little idea what to expect

Geo

In article , Alan Gould
writes

UK rec. gardening.

We too grow organic produce in Lincs. and we too have recently completed
a greenhouse renovation in time for this year's planting.


Alan how did you renovate the staging?

Janet
--
Janet Tweedy
Dalmatian Telegraph
http://www.lancedal.demon.co.uk

In article , Janet Tweedy
writes

Alan how did you renovate the staging?

This particular greenhouse is 'Dutch' type, i.e. sloping sides and has
no staging, but we have self built staging along two sides of an upright
sided 30ft. x 30ft. greenhouse and along one side our 15ft. x 30ft.
polytunnel. I construct a frame using reclaimed timber and angle iron,
then top it with panels of whatever suitable material is available. The
height is usually about table height and the depth about 2'6".

Up to that point the job has cost almost nothing, but then we put on a
fairly strong black polythene sheet and cover that with capillary
matting. We prefer to use new material for that. With that system of
watering, the staging needs to be accurately level, or the watering will
be uneven. We usually replace the capillary after 3 or 4 years.


The renovated greenhouse is also 15ft. x 30ft. originally built we guess
about forty years ago. It was of standard sized 5ft. x 30in. greenhouse
glass panels, but all the glass had long gone and the skeleton stood
derelict for the last ten years. The main framework was badly
deteriorated, but it was held with strong metal brackets, so I was able
to restructure it, using mainly 2x2 timber. The panels had distorted
with time, so we replaced the glass with a UVI/EVA polythene sheet, at a
quarter of the cost of glass. We were lucky enough to find a still day
in March on which to get the 20ft. x 30ft. sheet over the main frame.

I took out the whole weed infested floor to a depth of 30ins., made a
compost heap of that, then replaced the floor with new own made organic
compost. The work began at Easter last year, I handed it over to Joan on
Mothering Sunday and only yesterday she planted our first crop in it -
seedlings of oriental salad leaves. The total cost of the renovation was
about £200 in all, but what would be the price of a new one of that size
including compost? We are very chuffed with it!
--
Alan & Joan Gould - North Lincs.

Geo writes

Thanks for the warm welcome everyone.
This is my first experience of usenet so its a bit strange but I`ve had

dealings
with trolls before
Very good. Can you bottom post please?

What am i going to grow? well anything that will grow in the conditions
i
guess.
That will be an ongoing experiment through all seasons.

Am i 21? i wish!
you can double that figure at least.
My football poster days are well and truly over i think.

The greenhouse is a geodesic dome, 14ft in diameter and has about 140
sq ft
floor area, a very strong and energy efficient shape.

It`s not finished yet due to the weather and family stuff but hopefully
i`ll
have it done before the decent weather arrives..i`m not in any
great rush.

I plan to use 2/5 of it as a fish room (seperated and well insulated)
with 1000
gals of water (mostly rainwater) to house my catfish.
The greenhouse part will be the 3/5 facing south with just over 160 sq
ft of
glazing.
The fish will provide the organic nutrients and irrigation for the
greenhouse
side.The plants will take out the nitrates and clean the
water for the fish.

Technically it`s called aquaponic but mother nature would call it
growing in
gravel next to a heavily stocked river

A bonus of the water is it provides thermal mass which reduces summer

temperature swings and should save some heating costs in winter.

So thats the plan, a bit unusual granted.. but it will be fun to see
what
happens.

Sounds really interesting and the sort of thing the Eden project should
be doing on a larger scale. I do like the mutual balance idea :-)

Did you know Kew had problems in the winter recently when they had
drained the large lily pond - only later did they find out the water had
been a major element of stabilising the temperature at night. Replaced
water in pond - no more problems!
--
David

Alan Gould writes
In article , Janet Tweedy
writes

Alan how did you renovate the staging?

This particular greenhouse is 'Dutch' type, i.e. sloping sides and has
no staging, but we have self built staging along two sides of an upright
sided 30ft. x 30ft. greenhouse and along one side our 15ft. x 30ft.
polytunnel. I construct a frame using reclaimed timber and angle iron,
then top it with panels of whatever suitable material is available. The
height is usually about table height and the depth about 2'6".

Up to that point the job has cost almost nothing, but then we put on a
fairly strong black polythene sheet and cover that with capillary
matting. We prefer to use new material for that. With that system of
watering, the staging needs to be accurately level, or the watering will
be uneven. We usually replace the capillary after 3 or 4 years.


The renovated greenhouse is also 15ft. x 30ft. originally built we guess
about forty years ago. It was of standard sized 5ft. x 30in. greenhouse
glass panels, but all the glass had long gone and the skeleton stood
derelict for the last ten years. The main framework was badly
deteriorated, but it was held with strong metal brackets, so I was able
to restructure it, using mainly 2x2 timber. The panels had distorted
with time, so we replaced the glass with a UVI/EVA polythene sheet, at a
quarter of the cost of glass. We were lucky enough to find a still day
in March on which to get the 20ft. x 30ft. sheet over the main frame.

I took out the whole weed infested floor to a depth of 30ins., made a
compost heap of that, then replaced the floor with new own made organic
compost. The work began at Easter last year, I handed it over to Joan on
Mothering Sunday and only yesterday she planted our first crop in it -
seedlings of oriental salad leaves. The total cost of the renovation was
about £200 in all, but what would be the price of a new one of that size
including compost? We are very chuffed with it!

So you should be, heavens that was some effort to set it up. Sounds a
proper job though.

--
David

Hi David,
I hadn`t seen that one reagrding Kew but i can imagine it would have a huge impact on the temperature difference (and heating costs)

I think Eden has a similar system in that they have a cliff face to the rear that stores daytime heat and radiates it back at night.
They also have enormous volumes of water that pour into the site that no doubt brings heat from surrounding land in the process.

They have a somewhat larger area than i do

Geo

In article , Dave
writes
So you should be, heavens that was some effort to set it up. Sounds a
proper job though.

Thanks, we are just in the process of finding out how it will all work
out in practice. I omitted to mention that the project revealed several
unexpected challenges, mostly arising from differences between poly-
tunnel and greenhouse design and operation. We have used both for many
years, but until I actually began replacing greenhouse glass with a
poly-tunnel cover, I had tended not to think too much about those.

One major difference is that greenhouses mostly have opening lights in
the roof and/or sides and one entrance door. Polytunnels do not have
lights, they allow passage of air through the ends. We have doors fitted
in the ends of our polytunnel so that it can be enclosed at cooler times
and either one or both end opened in warmer weather. The restored
greenhouse used to have one entrance door and four roof lights, so to
replace the lights, I constructed a new door at the other end.

I then laid a 30" wide brieze block walking path along the length
because it is a permanent structure, whereas polytunnels are designed to
be mobile, and mostly have an earth or grass path. That means we can
enter it or ventilate it from either end, as we do the polytunnel, and
we can work the beds from the path as we did before the restoration.

Polytunnel covers are usually pinned down at the sides with soil or
whatever, but this cover is fixed in place with lats at the sides and to
the bottom main structure rails. The cover fixings had to be such that
could be taken off when a new cover is needed - after 5 or so years.

And so on ad infinitum. Re the effort, it was never onerous because here
was a gardener working in and improving his [and her] garden, i.e. it
was a labour of love. It never took priority over other garden jobs, I
did an hour or two on it on most days, leaving myself plenty of time to
look after our two acres of mixed garden. It also enabled me to think
over snags rather than blundering on into too many difficulties.
At age 77, one has to plan to the physical resources available.
--
Alan & Joan Gould - North Lincs.

In article , Dave
writes

Well done both of you! I'd just like to add that if I can be as fit and
active and up-to-date with whatever the technology is in 20 years time
then I will be more than satisfied. My dream is to be able to garden
here for ever, I can think of no more satisfying way to spend my time
than working with nature and plants and wildlife and in some small way
adding to the wonderful gardens we have in this small but remarkable
country.

Thank you David. Gardening is the part of our lives which gives us the
opportunity to be creative and express ourselves in any way we choose.
It also provides us the health and sense of purpose needed to do it.
We gain much pleasure from the results, even more from the time spent
achieving them. We sincerely hope that you will find similar joy.
--
Alan & Joan Gould - North Lincs.