Look everyone...we need to clear up one or two points here.

(1) 21st June is the Summer Solstice, which to most people is traditionally
called Midsummers Day or the 'Start of Summer' (which I think is weird, but
hey...). It is the longest day of the yesr for the northern hemisphere, and
is determined by the Earth's orbital inclination, or tilt, of 23.5 degrees.

(2) Any other traditional dates mean very little other just dates, as the
calendar has changed so many times since these traditions began.

So lets stop arguing - 21st June it is
"June Hughes" wrote in message
...
In article , Ophelia
writes

"June Hughes" wrote in message
...
In article , Ophelia
writes
Does anyone know the date of this please?

Me. 24 June. My birthday

Oh I say June) It must be you then))

you shall have a flower for your ear

Thanks Ophelia.
--
June Hughes

"Mark" wrote in message
...
Look everyone...we need to clear up one or two points here.

(1) 21st June is the Summer Solstice, which to most people is
traditionally
called Midsummers Day or the 'Start of Summer' (which I think is weird,
but
hey...). It is the longest day of the yesr for the northern hemisphere,
and
is determined by the Earth's orbital inclination, or tilt, of 23.5
degrees.

(2) Any other traditional dates mean very little other just dates, as the
calendar has changed so many times since these traditions began.

So lets stop arguing - 21st June it is


Oeerrrrr so manly What do you think ladies?

O ))

In article , Mark
writes
Look everyone...we need to clear up one or two points here.

(1) 21st June is the Summer Solstice, which to most people is traditionally
called Midsummers Day or the 'Start of Summer' (which I think is weird, but
hey...). It is the longest day of the yesr for the northern hemisphere, and
is determined by the Earth's orbital inclination, or tilt, of 23.5 degrees.

I don't believe that is strictly true. It's like saying the sun always
rises in the east.

(2) Any other traditional dates mean very little other just dates, as the
calendar has changed so many times since these traditions began.

exactly, so why 21 June? Actually, I don't really see the point in
arguing
about it. We're never going to agree and unless you are a druid, it
doesn't really matter. (unless of course, the 24th is your birthday).
Have a look on Google and you will see the various opinions.
--
June Hughes

in article , June Hughes at
wrote on 30/5/03 7:24 pm:

snip
(unless of course, the 24th is your birthday).
Have a look on Google and you will see the various opinions.

Well - it's our wedding anniversary and to us, it's Midsummer's Day. So
there. ;-))
--

Sacha
www.hillhousenursery.co.uk
(remove the 'x' to email me)

In article , Ophelia
writes

"Mark" wrote in message
...
Look everyone...we need to clear up one or two points here.

(1) 21st June is the Summer Solstice, which to most people is
traditionally
called Midsummers Day or the 'Start of Summer' (which I think is weird,
but
hey...). It is the longest day of the yesr for the northern hemisphere,
and
is determined by the Earth's orbital inclination, or tilt, of 23.5
degrees.

(2) Any other traditional dates mean very little other just dates, as the
calendar has changed so many times since these traditions began.

So lets stop arguing - 21st June it is


Oeerrrrr so manly What do you think ladies?

I've no disagreement that 21st June is summer solstice. I'm not sure how
anyone knows that 'most' people call it midsummers day. I certainly
don't, nor did my relatives and friends.

And yes, the calendar has changed a lot ... but we still tend to accept
that 25th Dec is Christmas Day ;-)

So there is no problem with having Midsummer Day on 24th June and
distinct from the summer solstice.
--
Kay Easton

Edward's earthworm page:
http://www.scarboro.demon.co.uk/edward/index.htm

Split the difference and go for the 22.5th of June ;-)

Jo

Ophelia wrote in message
...

"Mark" wrote in message
...
Look everyone...we need to clear up one or two points here.

(1) 21st June is the Summer Solstice, which to most people is
traditionally
called Midsummers Day or the 'Start of Summer' (which I think is weird,
but
hey...). It is the longest day of the yesr for the northern hemisphere,
and
is determined by the Earth's orbital inclination, or tilt, of 23.5
degrees.

(2) Any other traditional dates mean very little other just dates, as
the
calendar has changed so many times since these traditions began.

So lets stop arguing - 21st June it is


Oeerrrrr so manly What do you think ladies?

O ))

In article , Sacha
writes
in article , June Hughes at
wrote on 30/5/03 7:24 pm:

snip
(unless of course, the 24th is your birthday).
Have a look on Google and you will see the various opinions.

Well - it's our wedding anniversary and to us, it's Midsummer's Day. So
there. ;-))

Hello Sacha. I shall remember to toast your wedding anniversary on my
birthday)
--
June Hughes

in article , June Hughes at
wrote on 30/5/03 11:57 pm:

In article , Sacha
writes
in article , June Hughes at
wrote on 30/5/03 7:24 pm:

snip
(unless of course, the 24th is your birthday).
Have a look on Google and you will see the various opinions.

Well - it's our wedding anniversary and to us, it's Midsummer's Day. So
there. ;-))

Hello Sacha. I shall remember to toast your wedding anniversary on my
birthday)

Oh, how nice! Champagne for at *least* 4, then!
--

Sacha
(remove the 'x' to email me)

"Sacha" wrote in message
...
in article , June Hughes at
wrote on 30/5/03 7:24 pm:

snip
(unless of course, the 24th is your birthday).
Have a look on Google and you will see the various opinions.

Well - it's our wedding anniversary and to us, it's Midsummer's Day. So
there. ;-))

Too right!!!

O

June Hughes wrote in message ...
In article , Mark
writes
Look everyone...we need to clear up one or two points here.

(1) 21st June is the Summer Solstice, which to most people is traditionally
called Midsummers Day or the 'Start of Summer' (which I think is weird, but
hey...). It is the longest day of the yesr for the northern hemisphere, and
is determined by the Earth's orbital inclination, or tilt, of 23.5 degrees.

I don't believe that is strictly true. It's like saying the sun always
rises in the east.

It's nothing at all like saying that!!!The Sun rises from somewhere in
the Eastern hemisphere every day, depending where you are. This varies
from a few degrees east of due north (at the north pole in
summer)through to barely rising just a few degrees from the south.

But it is a fact that 21st June (on the modern calendar) is always the
longest day. This is because the year is the time for one complete
Eart orbit of the Sun (=365.256 days). 21st December is always the
shortest.

The fact that that .256 days exists means that we have leap years and
leap seconds etc.


(2) Any other traditional dates mean very little other just dates, as the
calendar has changed so many times since these traditions began.

exactly, so why 21 June?

See the above.

Actually, I don't really see the point in
arguing
about it. We're never going to agree and unless you are a druid, it
doesn't really matter. (unless of course, the 24th is your birthday).
Have a look on Google and you will see the various opinions.

What disagreement can you possibly have with science that has proof???

If you want any further clarification, let me know!

Mark

In article , Someone
Like You writes
June Hughes wrote in message
...
In article , Mark
writes
Look everyone...we need to clear up one or two points here.

(1) 21st June is the Summer Solstice, which to most people is traditionally
called Midsummers Day or the 'Start of Summer' (which I think is weird, but
hey...). It is the longest day of the yesr for the northern hemisphere, and
is determined by the Earth's orbital inclination, or tilt, of 23.5 degrees.

I don't believe that is strictly true. It's like saying the sun always
rises in the east.

It's nothing at all like saying that!!!The Sun rises from somewhere in
the Eastern hemisphere every day, depending where you are. This varies
from a few degrees east of due north (at the north pole in
summer)through to barely rising just a few degrees from the south.

Somewhere in the Eastern hemisphere. So what is your argument? The sun
does not rise exactly at the same point on all days.

But it is a fact that 21st June (on the modern calendar) is always the
longest day. This is because the year is the time for one complete
Eart orbit of the Sun (=365.256 days). 21st December is always the
shortest.

No-one says 21st June isn't the longest day. However, 24 June is known
as Midsummers Day. There is a difference.

The fact that that .256 days exists means that we have leap years and
leap seconds etc.


(2) Any other traditional dates mean very little other just dates, as the
calendar has changed so many times since these traditions began.

exactly, so why 21 June?

See the above.

Actually, I don't really see the point in
arguing
about it. We're never going to agree and unless you are a druid, it
doesn't really matter. (unless of course, the 24th is your birthday).
Have a look on Google and you will see the various opinions.

What disagreement can you possibly have with science that has proof???

If you want any further clarification, let me know!

No comment except to say that the longest day and Midsummers day are two
different things.
--
June Hughes

Xref: kermit uk.rec.gardening:147304

OK, time to wade in...

"June Hughes" wrote
Someone Like You writes
What disagreement can you possibly have with science that has proof???

If you want any further clarification, let me know!

No comment except to say that the longest day and Midsummers day are two
different things.

What tosh, I thinks, of course midsummer's day co-incides with the
solstice... I've been to Sweden and watched the dancing round the midsummer
pole on the solstice. So I did a bit of googling...

http://www.irishfestivals.net/midsummersday.htm says:
The festival is primarily a Celtic fire festival, representing the
middle of summer, and the shortening of the days on their gradual march to
winter. Midsummer is traditionally celebrated on either the 23rd or 24th of
June, although the longest day actually falls on the 21st of June. The
importance of the day to our ancestors can be traced back many thousands of
years, and many stone circles and other ancient monuments are aligned to the
sunrise on Midsummer's Day. Probably the most famous alignment is that at
Stonehenge, where the sun rises over the heel stone, framed by the giant
trilithons on Midsummer morning.

This last bit is a little odd, as I thought all the pagans and druids hung
out at stonehenge on the solstice not 24 June - perhaps the 'real' ones do
go on 24th, of course, in peace and solitude, while letting the 'trendy'
pagans (and the media) clutter up the solstice in ignorance ;-) That said,
this explanation ties in nicely with Christmas, which is, by timing, a
modern hijacking of an older festival, also a few days after the solstice.

So with several sites confirming that 21st is Midsummer's Day in Sweden,
while several others claim Midsummers is also known as St John's Day and
celebrated on 23-24 June (another Christian hijacking?), I think it is
reasonably safe to say that Midsummer's day can be what and when you want it
to be, and its date bears no fundamental relationship to the solstice.

There are however some confused people out the
http://www.bbhs.suffolk.sch.uk/tradi...midsummer.html claims that
"Midsummer is celebrated at the summer solstice in June. It's a festival of
light and midsummer's beauty. Sun is longest above the horizon and in the
north all the night. It's called "nightless night". Midsummer June 24 th is
also a day of the Finnish flag." This seems to be a UK school's site, so
I'm a little concerned that they seem to think the solstice is 24 June - and
even if they don't, they should be making it clearer that they undestand the
difference!

Ho hum...

Martin, getting ready to duck ;-)

also a day of the Finnish flag."

The Finnish flag? Is that the black and white chequered thing they wave at
the end of the Grand Prix? ;-)

June Hughes wrote:

But it is a fact that 21st June (on the modern calendar) is always the
longest day. This is because the year is the time for one complete
Eart orbit of the Sun (=365.256 days). 21st December is always the
shortest.

No-one says 21st June isn't the longest day. However, 24 June is known
as Midsummers Day. There is a difference.

As I said earlier in the thread 24th June "Midsummer Day" is a Quarter
Day, one of four (surprise!) on which, traditionally, bills are paid.

See (for example) http://www.pbenyon.plus.com/Misc/Quarter_days.html

Though I still don't agree with the Quarter days being the beginnings
of the four seasons.

--
Chris Green )

In article , Someone
Like You writes
What disagreement can you possibly have with science that has proof???

Midsummer day is not a scientific concept. It is a traditional date,
like Christmas Day. It is therefore not provable by scientific means
(other than by the methods of historical research to determine when
people in the past have celebrated it).

You have not presented any evidence to show that Midsummer day has been
traditional observed at the summer solstice, only evidence that the
summer solstice is on 21st June. That was not in dispute.
--
Kay Easton

Edward's earthworm page:
http://www.scarboro.demon.co.uk/edward/index.htm