On 30/11/2015 20:07, Christina Websell wrote:

I have quite a few American friends and we disagree all the time about their
idea of English and mine. American English is very different from "English"
English.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kcHKm0cm-jI


--
mailto: news {at} admac {dot] myzen {dot} co {dot} uk

"Fran Farmer" wrote in message
...
On 6/12/2015 8:43 AM, Christina Websell wrote:
"David Hill" wrote in message
...
On 05/12/2015 20:44, Christina Websell wrote:


Americans think they speak English, I can assure them that they don't.



Glad that has been sorted out once and for all.

grin Americans used to speak English once: now it's American.

I saw a very interesting TV show quite a few years ago on just this topic.
It suggested that the English now spoken by Americans is more like the
English spoken in the UK a few centuries ago than the sort of English now
spoken in the UK.

The show cited both words still used by Americans that have changed use
over time in the UK and the accent. One example I recall is the way
Americans still use the word "kettle" (ie, a cooking pot, not a spouted
water boiling thingamabob) which is the way it used to be used in the UK
centuries ago. Also the accent in the long "a" when American say "bath"
is the way it used to be said in the UK centuries ago.

Basically, the show said that it was the UK which had changed in the way
it used English whereas Americans had stayed more in line with the speech
and usage of the UK centuries ago.

well, lets not tell an American how to speak English eh? they never will.

On 6/12/2015 8:25 PM, Martin wrote:
On Sun, 6 Dec 2015 09:12:51 +1100, Fran Farmer
wrote:

On 6/12/2015 8:43 AM, Christina Websell wrote:
"David Hill" wrote in message
...
On 05/12/2015 20:44, Christina Websell wrote:


Americans think they speak English, I can assure them that they don't.



Glad that has been sorted out once and for all.

grin Americans used to speak English once: now it's American.

I saw a very interesting TV show quite a few years ago on just this
topic. It suggested that the English now spoken by Americans is more
like the English spoken in the UK a few centuries ago than the sort of
English now spoken in the UK.

The show cited both words still used by Americans that have changed use
over time in the UK and the accent. One example I recall is the way
Americans still use the word "kettle" (ie, a cooking pot, not a spouted
water boiling thingamabob) which is the way it used to be used in the UK
centuries ago. Also the accent in the long "a" when American say "bath"
is the way it used to be said in the UK centuries ago.

The way bath is pronounced in UK depends on where one comes from.

Do those places in the UK pronounce "bath" with a long "a" in an
American fashion or do you just mean that there are regional variations
of the way the word "bath" is said?

On 06/12/15 12:05, Fran Farmer wrote:
On 6/12/2015 8:25 PM, Martin wrote:
On Sun, 6 Dec 2015 09:12:51 +1100, Fran Farmer
wrote:

On 6/12/2015 8:43 AM, Christina Websell wrote:
"David Hill" wrote in message
...
On 05/12/2015 20:44, Christina Websell wrote:


Americans think they speak English, I can assure them that they don't.



Glad that has been sorted out once and for all.

grin Americans used to speak English once: now it's American.

I saw a very interesting TV show quite a few years ago on just this
topic. It suggested that the English now spoken by Americans is more
like the English spoken in the UK a few centuries ago than the sort of
English now spoken in the UK.

The show cited both words still used by Americans that have changed use
over time in the UK and the accent. One example I recall is the way
Americans still use the word "kettle" (ie, a cooking pot, not a spouted
water boiling thingamabob) which is the way it used to be used in the UK
centuries ago. Also the accent in the long "a" when American say "bath"
is the way it used to be said in the UK centuries ago.

The way bath is pronounced in UK depends on where one comes from.

Do those places in the UK pronounce "bath" with a long "a" in an American
fashion or do you just mean that there are regional variations of the way the
word "bath" is said?

In the NW at least it is pronounced with a short "a", whereas
in the south it is pronounced "barth" with a long "a".

I have no idea how it is pronounced in Glaswegian or Geordie.

"Christina Websell" wrote:

Americans think they speak English,

I should probably remain silent and be just though a fool, but:

I never thought I spoke English, though I understand a lot of it passably.
Watching "Last of the Summer Wine" has taught me there are subsets of
English that might as well be Swahili!


--
Gary Woods AKA K2AHC- PGP key on request, or at home.earthlink.net/~garygarlic
Zone 5/4 in upstate New York, 1420' elevation. NY WO G

On 06/12/15 14:33, Gary Woods wrote:
"Christina Websell" wrote:

Americans think they speak English,

I should probably remain silent and be just though a fool, but:

I never thought I spoke English, though I understand a lot of it passably.
Watching "Last of the Summer Wine" has taught me there are subsets of
English that might as well be Swahili!

It's not just accents, but local language usage. You won't find anyone
outside a church using "thee" in the south.

Many years ago I was on holiday in New England during the Fall. While I
was staying at a tiny hotel in Chester, Vermont, three Oklahomans
appeared for a couple of days. We met at breakfast next day, all
chatting away quite amicably. After breakfast, I confessed to the hotel
owner that I couldn't understand a word they were saying, as their
accents were so strong. He just grinned and said that he couldn't
understand them, either! I have no doubt they couldn't understand a
British accent. But we were all too polite to keep saying "Could you
repeat that, please?"

--

Jeff

On 05/12/2015 20:44, Christina Websell wrote:
Americans think they speak English, I can assure them that they don't.

"Do you speak English?"
"Yes, and I understand American"

Bob Heinlein, Glory Road. And he was a Yank...

Andy

In article ,
Gary Woods wrote:
"Christina Websell" wrote:

Americans think they speak English,

I should probably remain silent and be just though a fool, but:

I never thought I spoke English, though I understand a lot of it passably.
Watching "Last of the Summer Wine" has taught me there are subsets of
English that might as well be Swahili!

Back in the 1960s, Wiltshire farm workers were unintelligible to
Londoners if they spoke as they did locally - a mere 80 miles way.
Most such variants have gone, killed by television, and even the
Cornish are now intelligible to Londoners. The major northern
dialects are pretty well the sole remaining ones.

And then there are things like Hinglish and Strine ....



Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

On 06/12/2015 17:16, Vir Campestris wrote:
On 05/12/2015 20:44, Christina Websell wrote:
Americans think they speak English, I can assure them that they don't.

"Do you speak English?"
"Yes, and I understand American"

Bob Heinlein, Glory Road. And he was a Yank...


I remember going on a AAA course at Motspur park in the mid 50's. The
course was headed by Jeff Dyson who was the national head coach.
As he was lecturing he would often come out with "and I say unto thee".
On that course was a lad from Cornwall, it wasn't till the 3rd day I
realised he was talking English,between his accent and his dialect.
Also when I was market gardening outside Hastings in the early 60's we
had a driver come down form Fort William to pick up some stuff we were
selling. My Boss was Irish but had been a fighter pilot in the war,
Margaret was Sussex born and bred and owing to my Father being a Captain
in the RFA I had been to many parts of the UK when he was home and we
were on board ship with him.
I found myself acting as an interpretor between My Boss and the driver.
So much for a common language in the UK.

On 12/6/2015 2:20 PM, David Hill wrote:
I remember going on a AAA course at Motspur park in the mid 50's. The
course was headed by Jeff Dyson who was the national head coach.
As he was lecturing he would often come out with "and I say unto thee".
On that course was a lad from Cornwall, it wasn't till the 3rd day I
realised he was talking English,between his accent and his dialect.
Also when I was market gardening outside Hastings in the early 60's we
had a driver come down form Fort William to pick up some stuff we were
selling. My Boss was Irish but had been a fighter pilot in the war,
Margaret was Sussex born and bred and owing to my Father being a Captain
in the RFA I had been to many parts of the UK when he was home and we
were on board ship with him.
I found myself acting as an interpretor between My Boss and the driver.
So much for a common language in the UK.

Years ago, I was offered a job in the personnel department of the
Scottish branch of a Texas company, because I could translate between
Texas English and Braid Scots.

On Sun, 6 Dec 2015 19:20:55 +0000, David Hill
wrote:


Margaret was Sussex born and bred and owing to my Father being a Captain
in the RFA I had been to many parts of the UK when he was home and we
were on board ship with him.
I found myself acting as an interpretor between My Boss and the driver.
So much for a common language in the UK.

I had to do that between two Scotsman about 15 years ago which seemed
a strange thing for an Englisman to be doing.
One was young,Engineer from the PS Waverley as it happened and spoke
with a Strong Glasgow accent but I was quite used to talking with him
while the other had come from Galloway but had lived in Bristol since
the 50's although he was often away as he was in the Merchant Navy.
That working in engine rooms which caused hearing damage resulting in
having to use a hearing aid didn't help.

G.Harman

On 6/12/2015 11:30 PM, Tom Gardner wrote:
On 06/12/15 12:05, Fran Farmer wrote:
On 6/12/2015 8:25 PM, Martin wrote:
On Sun, 6 Dec 2015 09:12:51 +1100, Fran Farmer
wrote:

On 6/12/2015 8:43 AM, Christina Websell wrote:
"David Hill" wrote in message
...
On 05/12/2015 20:44, Christina Websell wrote:


Americans think they speak English, I can assure them that they
don't.



Glad that has been sorted out once and for all.

grin Americans used to speak English once: now it's American.

I saw a very interesting TV show quite a few years ago on just this
topic. It suggested that the English now spoken by Americans is more
like the English spoken in the UK a few centuries ago than the sort of
English now spoken in the UK.

The show cited both words still used by Americans that have changed use
over time in the UK and the accent. One example I recall is the way
Americans still use the word "kettle" (ie, a cooking pot, not a spouted
water boiling thingamabob) which is the way it used to be used in
the UK
centuries ago. Also the accent in the long "a" when American say
"bath"
is the way it used to be said in the UK centuries ago.

The way bath is pronounced in UK depends on where one comes from.

Do those places in the UK pronounce "bath" with a long "a" in an American
fashion or do you just mean that there are regional variations of the
way the
word "bath" is said?

In the NW at least it is pronounced with a short "a", whereas
in the south it is pronounced "barth" with a long "a".

When I used the term "long 'a'" I was trying to convey how I've heard
Americans say 'bath' which is less like 'barth' but more like the 'a' in
'bat'. I'm sure there is some symbol that applies and which would tell
more knowledgeable peeps instantly how I menat it to sound, but every
time I've tried to figure out what my dictionary means by it's symbols,
I've lost the will to live.

I have no idea how it is pronounced in Glaswegian or Geordie.

:-)) Regional dialects are very interesting IMO

On 7/12/2015 5:56 AM, Nick Maclaren wrote:
In article ,
Gary Woods wrote:
"Christina Websell" wrote:

Americans think they speak English,

I should probably remain silent and be just though a fool, but:

I never thought I spoke English, though I understand a lot of it passably.
Watching "Last of the Summer Wine" has taught me there are subsets of
English that might as well be Swahili!

Back in the 1960s, Wiltshire farm workers were unintelligible to
Londoners if they spoke as they did locally - a mere 80 miles way.
Most such variants have gone, killed by television, and even the
Cornish are now intelligible to Londoners. The major northern
dialects are pretty well the sole remaining ones.

And then there are things like Hinglish and Strine ....

You forgot the Yarpies and the Kiwis.

On 06/12/15 22:34, Fran Farmer wrote:
On 6/12/2015 11:30 PM, Tom Gardner wrote:
On 06/12/15 12:05, Fran Farmer wrote:
Do those places in the UK pronounce "bath" with a long "a" in an American
fashion or do you just mean that there are regional variations of the
way the
word "bath" is said?

In the NW at least it is pronounced with a short "a", whereas
in the south it is pronounced "barth" with a long "a".

When I used the term "long 'a'" I was trying to convey how I've heard Americans
say 'bath' which is less like 'barth' but more like the 'a' in 'bat'.

Ah, that's the opposite way round! The NW variant sounds like
"ba-th" (as in "bat"), OTOH the Bath natives pronounce
their town "bar-th", and southerners use that for everything
to do with washing. Except when they don't, e.g. bathe
is pronounced "bay-th".


I'm sure
there is some symbol that applies and which would tell more knowledgeable peeps
instantly how I menat it to sound, but every time I've tried to figure out what
my dictionary means by it's symbols, I've lost the will to live.

Just so, although I'm sure there's a website somewhere which
converts, say, bæθ fənɛtɪks into the sounds for "bath phonetics".


I have no idea how it is pronounced in Glaswegian or Geordie.

:-)) Regional dialects are very interesting IMO

"Interesting" in the Chinese sense

Then you get into the downright perverse, e.g. those at
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...o nunciations
which has both UK and US pitfalls.

"Martin" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 6 Dec 2015 09:12:51 +1100, Fran Farmer
wrote:

On 6/12/2015 8:43 AM, Christina Websell wrote:
"David Hill" wrote in message
...
On 05/12/2015 20:44, Christina Websell wrote:


Americans think they speak English, I can assure them that they don't.



Glad that has been sorted out once and for all.

grin Americans used to speak English once: now it's American.

I saw a very interesting TV show quite a few years ago on just this
topic. It suggested that the English now spoken by Americans is more
like the English spoken in the UK a few centuries ago than the sort of
English now spoken in the UK.

The show cited both words still used by Americans that have changed use
over time in the UK and the accent. One example I recall is the way
Americans still use the word "kettle" (ie, a cooking pot, not a spouted
water boiling thingamabob) which is the way it used to be used in the UK
centuries ago. Also the accent in the long "a" when American say "bath"
is the way it used to be said in the UK centuries ago.

The way bath is pronounced in UK depends on where one comes from.
--
English is constantly evolving and it evolves from the UK. Because we are
English and it's our language. Americans speak American. Do you have a
faucet in your house, does your car have a hood or fender? I rest my case.