Hi there

November approaches and we have decided where to put new trees and
brushes along our hedges in the north-west and north-east of our
terrain.

These hedges mark the borderline between the past and the future, death
and life, chemical farming and my kind of gardening.

The brushes which survived until now are hollies (which we like very
much) and whin (which we tolerate). The rest is in poor condition or
dead.

My main worry are the high trees that should grow here and there in the
hedge, but do not, currently. I will give order to some young oaks to
join the frontier but do not feel good about that.

Have you any experience to share on the subject? I know, it would be
an advantage, if I knew the kind of filth that my dearest neighbour is
using in such abundance that the hedges die, but the latest intelligence
shows these farmers do no longer decide themselves about the moment to
spread their Agent Orange, nor “flavour� or quantiteis.

I need the toughest plants that I can get.

TY,

Michael
--
Location: Lower Normandy (Orne), France
GnuPG/OpenPGP 4096R/3216CF02 2013-11-15 [expires: 2015-11-15]
sub 4096R/2751C550 2013-11-15 [expires: 2015-11-15]

On 11/10/2014 12:11, Michael Uplawski wrote:
Hi there

November approaches and we have decided where to put new trees and
brushes along our hedges in the north-west and north-east of our
terrain.

These hedges mark the borderline between the past and the future, death
and life, chemical farming and my kind of gardening.

The brushes which survived until now are hollies (which we like very
much) and whin (which we tolerate). The rest is in poor condition or
dead.

My main worry are the high trees that should grow here and there in the
hedge, but do not, currently. I will give order to some young oaks to
join the frontier but do not feel good about that.

Have you any experience to share on the subject? I know, it would be
an advantage, if I knew the kind of filth that my dearest neighbour is
using in such abundance that the hedges die, but the latest intelligence
shows these farmers do no longer decide themselves about the moment to
spread their Agent Orange, nor “flavour� or quantiteis.

I need the toughest plants that I can get.

TY,

Michael



As you clearly know, there are no guarantees with this type of planting.
However, my advice would be to look at the hedgerows which surround
this farm, see what is doing well, and plant those shrubs/trees in
sufficient numbers that something is bound to survive. For a dense
hedge, it is often advised to plant two staggered rows of the chosen
plant(s). If you have space, you may find planting three staggered rows
will give you a denser hedge sooner, creating a wider buffer zone.

Since 'your' farmer is using noxious chemicals, I assume he's not
keeping cattle or other livestock(?), so you could try Yew (Taxus
baccata) nearest his land. (Yew is poisonous, so you ought not to use it
near livestock). Also try Hawthorn (Crataegus monogyna) and Blackthorn
(Prunus spinosa). Since it already does well for you, and you like it,
add more holly. You could even allow one to grow into a tree; likewise
the Hawthorn. It may be worth trying Berberis. There are evergreen and
deciduous forms.

Whatever you plant, you will really need to buy bare root to get
sufficient quantities at a reasonable price. Have a look at some of the
classified ads in the back of gardening magazines, or Google "hedging".
I'm sure if you contact a good hedging nursery, they will be able to
tell you what will withstand poisons better than most, as well as what
will do well in your area.

--
Spider.
On high ground in SE London
gardening on heavy clay

On 11/10/2014 13:24, Spider wrote:
On 11/10/2014 12:11, Michael Uplawski wrote:
Hi there

November approaches and we have decided where to put new trees and
brushes along our hedges in the north-west and north-east of our
terrain.

These hedges mark the borderline between the past and the future, death
and life, chemical farming and my kind of gardening.

The brushes which survived until now are hollies (which we like very
much) and whin (which we tolerate). The rest is in poor condition or
dead.

My main worry are the high trees that should grow here and there in the
hedge, but do not, currently. I will give order to some young oaks to
join the frontier but do not feel good about that.

Have you any experience to share on the subject? I know, it would be
an advantage, if I knew the kind of filth that my dearest neighbour is
using in such abundance that the hedges die, but the latest intelligence
shows these farmers do no longer decide themselves about the moment to
spread their Agent Orange, nor “flavour� or quantiteis.

I need the toughest plants that I can get.

TY,

Michael



As you clearly know, there are no guarantees with this type of planting.
However, my advice would be to look at the hedgerows which surround
this farm, see what is doing well, and plant those shrubs/trees in
sufficient numbers that something is bound to survive. For a dense
hedge, it is often advised to plant two staggered rows of the chosen
plant(s). If you have space, you may find planting three staggered rows
will give you a denser hedge sooner, creating a wider buffer zone.

Since 'your' farmer is using noxious chemicals, I assume he's not
keeping cattle or other livestock(?), so you could try Yew (Taxus
baccata) nearest his land. (Yew is poisonous, so you ought not to use it
near livestock). Also try Hawthorn (Crataegus monogyna) and Blackthorn
(Prunus spinosa). Since it already does well for you, and you like it,
add more holly. You could even allow one to grow into a tree; likewise
the Hawthorn. It may be worth trying Berberis. There are evergreen and
deciduous forms.

Whatever you plant, you will really need to buy bare root to get
sufficient quantities at a reasonable price. Have a look at some of the
classified ads in the back of gardening magazines, or Google "hedging".
I'm sure if you contact a good hedging nursery, they will be able to
tell you what will withstand poisons better than most, as well as what
will do well in your area.

Out of interest, what crops is your neighbor spraying?

In article ,
says...
Since 'your' farmer is using noxious chemicals, I assume he's not
keeping cattle or other livestock(?)

so you could try Yew (Taxus
baccata) nearest his land. (Yew is poisonous, so you ought not to use it
near livestock).

That is extremely poor advice IMO. No farmer is going to welcome the
planting of a yew hedge on his boundary.

In later years the neighbour (or a different owner) may plant some crop
where livestock are turned in to forage the leftovers; or rotate the
land use to grazing pasture which he rents out.

Janet

"Michael Uplawski" wrote
November approaches and we have decided where to put new trees and
brushes along our hedges in the north-west and north-east of our
terrain.

These hedges mark the borderline between the past and the future, death
and life, chemical farming and my kind of gardening.

The brushes which survived until now are hollies (which we like very
much) and whin (which we tolerate). The rest is in poor condition or
dead.

My main worry are the high trees that should grow here and there in the
hedge, but do not, currently. I will give order to some young oaks to
join the frontier but do not feel good about that.

Have you any experience to share on the subject? I know, it would be
an advantage, if I knew the kind of filth that my dearest neighbour is
using in such abundance that the hedges die, but the latest intelligence
shows these farmers do no longer decide themselves about the moment to
spread their Agent Orange, nor “flavour� or quantiteis.

I need the toughest plants that I can get.


So holly has survived, it's an evergreen with rather tough leaves so look
for other plants with similar leaves. Escallonia is one I can think of. Yew
might work and although it's not good for cattle that is his problem, he
would have to put another fence away from yours to keep them away from it.
--
Regards. Bob Hobden.
Posted to this Newsgroup from the W of London, UK

Good evening,

On Sat, 11 Oct 2014 14:06:43 +0100, David wrote:

Out of interest, what crops is your neighbor spraying?

Mainly mais as silage fodder for his kettle. It is the same big field
which adjoins our own land on two sides. Last year, half of the surface
was used for wheat. At the moment, a green fertilizer (either mustard or
rapseed) is starting to grow, as is now an obligation in France, as you
are no longer allowed to let the soil uncovered during winter.

Michael

--
Location: Lower Normandy (Orne), France
GnuPG/OpenPGP 4096R/3216CF02 2013-11-15 [expires: 2015-11-15]
sub 4096R/2751C550 2013-11-15 [expires: 2015-11-15]

On 11/10/2014 22:40, Michael Uplawski wrote:
Good evening,

On Sat, 11 Oct 2014 14:06:43 +0100, David wrote:

Out of interest, what crops is your neighbor spraying?

Mainly mais as silage fodder for his kettle. It is the same big field
which adjoins our own land on two sides. Last year, half of the surface
was used for wheat. At the moment, a green fertilizer (either mustard or
rapseed) is starting to grow, as is now an obligation in France, as you
are no longer allowed to let the soil uncovered during winter.

Michael

Chances are he is spraying Glyphosate

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glyphosate

On Sat, 11 Oct 2014 13:24:36 +0100, Spider wrote:
On 11/10/2014 12:11, Michael Uplawski wrote:

However, my advice would be to look at the hedgerows which surround
this farm, see what is doing well, and plant those shrubs/trees in
sufficient numbers that something is bound to survive.

An interesting suggestion. I will take a look and compare to the other
hedges in the neighbourhood.

For a dense
hedge, it is often advised to plant two staggered rows of the chosen
plant(s). If you have space, you may find planting three staggered rows
will give you a denser hedge sooner, creating a wider buffer zone.

There will be two rows initially, with an overall depth of about five to
six meters, that I like to “fill up�, subsequently. My wife prefers to
leave a path in the middle but I would rather let those hedges live
their life and give up the extra space.

Since 'your' farmer is using noxious chemicals, I assume he's not
keeping cattle or other livestock(?).

Right.

so you could try Yew (Taxus
baccata) nearest his land. (Yew is poisonous, so you ought not to use it
near livestock).

I will probably exclude Yew, as there may be chickens in the near
future, alternating in different “parks� (cannot find an English
equivalent for the free space outside the coop).


Also try Hawthorn (Crataegus monogyna) and Blackthorn

We already have some hawthorn-trees and even a smaller exemplary
close to the “death-zone�. Blackthorn is frequent in our region. I will
ask for both when I buy new plants.

I'm sure if you contact a good hedging nursery, they will be able to
tell you what will withstand poisons better than most, as well as what
will do well in your area.

Yes I will do that and thanks for naming the species above.

Michael


--
Location: Lower Normandy (Orne), France
GnuPG/OpenPGP 4096R/3216CF02 2013-11-15 [expires: 2015-11-15]
sub 4096R/2751C550 2013-11-15 [expires: 2015-11-15]

In article ,
Janet wrote:
In article ,
says...
Since 'your' farmer is using noxious chemicals, I assume he's not
keeping cattle or other livestock(?)

so you could try Yew (Taxus
baccata) nearest his land. (Yew is poisonous, so you ought not to use it
near livestock).

That is extremely poor advice IMO. No farmer is going to welcome the
planting of a yew hedge on his boundary.

In later years the neighbour (or a different owner) may plant some crop
where livestock are turned in to forage the leftovers; or rotate the
land use to grazing pasture which he rents out.

It depends on how much of a Clue he has. Ones that know about
the actual risk (as distinct from the hysteria) won't care.
There is plenty of pasture with yew in their hedges, and I have
seen it growing as a tree in the middle of some.

The only real danger is if the yew is cut and left lying (because
it becomes slightly less bitter) and the stock don't have enough
good pasture or browsing. So it's the bad farmers that have the
trouble - and, of course, they are the ones that blame everything
except themselves.


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

Good afternoon,

On Sun, 12 Oct 2014 10:01:49 +0100 (BST),
Nick Maclaren wrote:

In later years the neighbour (or a different owner) may plant some crop
where livestock are turned in to forage the leftovers; or rotate the
land use to grazing pasture which he rents out.

It depends on how much of a Clue he has. Ones that know about
the actual risk (as distinct from the hysteria) won't care.

Though you have no reason to give much importance to my statements, I
share Nick's point of view. As I am new in about everything and
everywhere, it is reassuring to be confronted in this thread with
species that appear to be downright native in this part of Normandy
(« if (m) » is “yew� is „Eibe (f)“, as we are about it).

The only real danger is if the yew is cut and left lying (because
it becomes slightly less bitter) and the stock don't have enough
good pasture or browsing.

As far as I knew chicken, they do not care much about anything and leave
behind a stony skeleton where there was green pastures weeks before.
I do not plan to leave them in the same park for such a long time, but
fear however that anything that leaves a yew, will sooner or later be
absorbed by a chicken.

So it's the bad farmers that have the
trouble - and, of course, they are the ones that blame everything
except themselves.

This could be a signature or an email-footer.

Cheerio,

Michael



Regards,
Nick Maclaren.


--
Location: Lower Normandy (Orne), France
GnuPG/OpenPGP 4096R/3216CF02 2013-11-15 [expires: 2015-11-15]
sub 4096R/2751C550 2013-11-15 [expires: 2015-11-15]