Article today in D Mail that it's not a good idea to feed birds during the
winter.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-2348635/Why-feeding-birds-winter-bad-Leaving-food-reduce-breeding-success-spring.html?ico=sciencetech^headlines

On Sat, 29 Jun 2013 10:11:13 +0100, "Dave Smith"
wrote:

Article today in D Mail that it's not a good idea to feed birds during the
winter.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-2348635/Why-feeding-birds-winter-bad-Leaving-food-reduce-breeding-success-spring.html?ico=sciencetech^headlines


Having read the original paper when it was published last week I would
summarise it as an interesting but fairly limited study of one species
in a woodland environment. The focus was primarily on winter feeding
of fat supplements which had an apparent impact on reproductive and
fledgling success.

The possible causes for this were the survival through the winter of
potential parent birds who would not normally make it through to the
reproductive stage - thus poor reproductive success; insufficient
spring/summer food to support increased number of fledglings and
unbalanced diet resulting in imperfect eggs.

It did point out that all year round feeding could well reverse any
adverse impact and it did cite other research which indicated that
supplementary nuts led to increased fledgling success.

From watching the activity on our feeders there is no doubt that blue
tits tend to favour fat supplement over seed but also spend a lot of
time on the nut feeder.
--
rbel

In article ,
lid says...

On Sat, 29 Jun 2013 11:35:00 +0100, rbel wrote:

On Sat, 29 Jun 2013 10:11:13 +0100, "Dave Smith"
wrote:

Article today in D Mail that it's not a good idea to feed birds during the
winter.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-2348635/Why-feeding-birds-winter-bad-Leaving-food-reduce-breeding-success-spring.html?ico=sciencetech^headlines


Having read the original paper when it was published last week I would
summarise it as an interesting but fairly limited study of one species
in a woodland environment. The focus was primarily on winter feeding
of fat supplements which had an apparent impact on reproductive and
fledgling success.

The possible causes for this were the survival through the winter of
potential parent birds who would not normally make it through to the
reproductive stage - thus poor reproductive success; insufficient
spring/summer food to support increased number of fledglings and
unbalanced diet resulting in imperfect eggs.

It did point out that all year round feeding could well reverse any
adverse impact and it did cite other research which indicated that
supplementary nuts led to increased fledgling success.

From watching the activity on our feeders there is no doubt that blue
tits tend to favour fat supplement over seed but also spend a lot of
time on the nut feeder.

Our tits gave low priority to the fat and went for the seeds. The fat
was only eaten when there were no seeds left. They are very fussy
about which seeds they will eat.

This could be a reflection on the quality/variety/age of the fat/seeds
offered.
We find that blue, coal and great tits are all avid feeders on
fatballs (with seed in)and right now, all their young are feeding there
too.

Janet.

On Sat, 29 Jun 2013 13:04:59 +0200, Martin wrote:



Our tits gave low priority to the fat and went for the seeds. The fat
was only eaten when there were no seeds left. They are very fussy
about which seeds they will eat.

The ones that visit my garden eat the days fresh seeds. Fat and
anything left in the seed feeder gets ignored unless they are really
hungry. They do a lot of pecking on a dead bush but I can't see
anything on it.

Steve

--
EasyNN-plus. Neural Networks plus. http://www.easynn.com
SwingNN. Forecast with Neural Networks. http://www.swingnn.com
JustNN. Just Neural Networks. http://www.justnn.com

On 29/06/2013 12:41, Janet wrote:
In article ,
lid says...

On Sat, 29 Jun 2013 11:35:00 +0100, rbel wrote:

On Sat, 29 Jun 2013 10:11:13 +0100, "Dave Smith"
wrote:

Article today in D Mail that it's not a good idea to feed birds during the
winter.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-2348635/Why-feeding-birds-winter-bad-Leaving-food-reduce-breeding-success-spring.html?ico=sciencetech^headlines


Having read the original paper when it was published last week I would
summarise it as an interesting but fairly limited study of one species
in a woodland environment. The focus was primarily on winter feeding
of fat supplements which had an apparent impact on reproductive and
fledgling success.

The possible causes for this were the survival through the winter of
potential parent birds who would not normally make it through to the
reproductive stage - thus poor reproductive success; insufficient
spring/summer food to support increased number of fledglings and
unbalanced diet resulting in imperfect eggs.

It did point out that all year round feeding could well reverse any
adverse impact and it did cite other research which indicated that
supplementary nuts led to increased fledgling success.

From watching the activity on our feeders there is no doubt that blue
tits tend to favour fat supplement over seed but also spend a lot of
time on the nut feeder.

Our tits gave low priority to the fat and went for the seeds. The fat
was only eaten when there were no seeds left. They are very fussy
about which seeds they will eat.

This could be a reflection on the quality/variety/age of the fat/seeds
offered.
We find that blue, coal and great tits are all avid feeders on
fatballs (with seed in)and right now, all their young are feeding there
too.

Janet.

If my "vultures" are anything to go by they eat almost everything that
is put out for them.
As I have said before I make my own bird food, Tesco value whole meal
bread (crumbed) dripping, Porridge oats and wild bird food seed mix from
the Range.
Apart from visiting adults I am feeding around a dozen families, as
foster dad I am left to look after and feed the children whilst Mum and
Dad are off having yet another family.
Yesterday was a record day, over lunch (Mine as well as theirs) I
counted 19 birds on the feeding station at one time with a lot more in
the sou rounding bushes and tees coming and going, with 9 birds in one
feeding station, and through all the chaos a greater spotted woodpecker
kept feeding oblivious to the sou rounding clamour.
David @ a sunny side of Swansea Bay.

Please note I made no reference to my great tits (something to do with
years of Zantac I believe)

On Sat, 29 Jun 2013 10:11:13 +0100, "Dave Smith"
wrote:

Article today in D Mail that it's not a good idea to feed birds during the
winter.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-2348635/Why-feeding-birds-winter-bad-Leaving-food-reduce-breeding-success-spring.html?ico=sciencetech^headlines


A photo caption says it all, I think: "Researchers suggest feeding all
year round may be a better solution."


--
Cheers, Jake
=======================================
URGling from the other end of Swansea Bay where it's
unusually just like Dave's end, only better

On 29/06/13 11:35, rbel wrote:

Having read the original paper when it was published last week I would
summarise it as an interesting but fairly limited study of one species
in a woodland environment. The focus was primarily on winter feeding
of fat supplements which had an apparent impact on reproductive and
fledgling success.

The possible causes for this were the survival through the winter of
potential parent birds who would not normally make it through to the
reproductive stage - thus poor reproductive success; insufficient
spring/summer food to support increased number of fledglings and
unbalanced diet resulting in imperfect eggs.

Much more likely to be salt residue in the fat.

--
Rusty Hinge

On 29/06/13 13:08, David Hill wrote:

Tesco value whole meal bread (crumbed)

Too much salt!

The birds rarely get any of my bread - I like it too much. Made with
strong wholemeal flour, shortening and yeast- sometimes water and less
frequently, milk.

--
Rusty Hinge

On 29/06/13 12:52, Stephen Wolstenholme wrote:
The ones that visit my garden eat the days fresh seeds. Fat and
anything left in the seed feeder gets ignored unless they are really
hungry. They do a lot of pecking on a dead bush but I can't see
anything on it.

Insects. They climb round the window frames on my house and murder small
things. They were noshing on ants a fortnight ago.

--
Rusty Hinge

The BTO made a number of points -

They were studies in woodland whose results are not necessarily translateable to garden birds (eg caterpillars are more abundant in woodland than gardens).

There were three studies in total, two on bluetits, one on gt spotted woodpeckers. The woodpeckers did better with supplementary feeding.

They were time limited, ie fat feeding during a short period only

They looked at productivity only, not overall success. Even if average broods were down, if more birds survived to breed, population overall would increase more

Their conclusion was "more study needed"

I don't know if this link is publicly available:
Are fatty foods bad for birds? | BTO - British Trust for Ornithology

On 29/06/2013 15:28, RustyHinge wrote:
On 29/06/13 13:08, David Hill wrote:

Tesco value whole meal bread (crumbed)

Too much salt!

The birds rarely get any of my bread - I like it too much. Made with
strong wholemeal flour, shortening and yeast- sometimes water and less
frequently, milk.

Well they have been having that mix for almost 4 years and they are thriving

On 2013-06-29 13:08:36 +0100, David Hill said:

On 29/06/2013 12:41, Janet wrote:
In article ,
lid says...

On Sat, 29 Jun 2013 11:35:00 +0100, rbel wrote:

On Sat, 29 Jun 2013 10:11:13 +0100, "Dave Smith"
wrote:

Article today in D Mail that it's not a good idea to feed birds during the
winter.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-2348635/Why-feeding-birds-winter-bad-Leaving-food-reduce-breeding-success-spring.html?ico=sciencetech^headlines



Having read the original paper when it was published last week I would
summarise it as an interesting but fairly limited study of one species
in a woodland environment. The focus was primarily on winter feeding
of fat supplements which had an apparent impact on reproductive and
fledgling success.

The possible causes for this were the survival through the winter of
potential parent birds who would not normally make it through to the
reproductive stage - thus poor reproductive success; insufficient
spring/summer food to support increased number of fledglings and
unbalanced diet resulting in imperfect eggs.

It did point out that all year round feeding could well reverse any
adverse impact and it did cite other research which indicated that
supplementary nuts led to increased fledgling success.

From watching the activity on our feeders there is no doubt that blue
tits tend to favour fat supplement over seed but also spend a lot of
time on the nut feeder.

Our tits gave low priority to the fat and went for the seeds. The fat
was only eaten when there were no seeds left. They are very fussy
about which seeds they will eat.

This could be a reflection on the quality/variety/age of the fat/seeds
offered.
We find that blue, coal and great tits are all avid feeders on
fatballs (with seed in)and right now, all their young are feeding there
too.

Janet.

If my "vultures" are anything to go by they eat almost everything that
is put out for them.
As I have said before I make my own bird food, Tesco value whole meal
bread (crumbed) dripping, Porridge oats and wild bird food seed mix
from the Range.
Apart from visiting adults I am feeding around a dozen families, as
foster dad I am left to look after and feed the children whilst Mum and
Dad are off having yet another family.
Yesterday was a record day, over lunch (Mine as well as theirs) I
counted 19 birds on the feeding station at one time with a lot more in
the sou rounding bushes and tees coming and going, with 9 birds in one
feeding station, and through all the chaos a greater spotted woodpecker
kept feeding oblivious to the sou rounding clamour.
David @ a sunny side of Swansea Bay.

Please note I made no reference to my great tits (something to do with
years of Zantac I believe)

We're finding the birds are *very* hungry. I can only guess that this
is because they've been raising and feeding chicks and with the cold
spring start, there are less insects around than normal at this time of
year. For the the first time ever, the rooks are trying to get seed
from the bird feeders. I must say they look utterly ridiculous, huge
as they are trying to cling onto those but at the same time, I feel
very sorry for them and very concerned. They're obviously quite
desperate to find food.
--

Sacha
www.hillhousenursery.com
South Devon
www.helpforheroes.org.uk

On 29/06/13 19:28, David Hill wrote:
On 29/06/2013 15:28, RustyHinge wrote:
On 29/06/13 13:08, David Hill wrote:

Tesco value whole meal bread (crumbed)

Too much salt!

The birds rarely get any of my bread - I like it too much. Made with
strong wholemeal flour, shortening and yeast- sometimes water and less
frequently, milk.

Well they have been having that mix for almost 4 years and they are
thriving

How can you be sure they are the same birds?

Most birds are unable to get rid of excess salt, and the effects are
cumulative. That's why one is advised not to hang out ham rind.

--
Rusty Hinge

On 29/06/13 22:44, Martin wrote:

Be glad you haven't got jackdaws. They are smart enough to get food
from the feeders and working in teams they can empty a feeder in a
day.

I have jackdaws (and have just frustrated their attempts to build a nest
in my chimney), and they haven't even investigated the feeders AFAIK.

--
Rusty Hinge

On 2013-06-29 22:44:22 +0100, Martin said:

On Sat, 29 Jun 2013 22:04:56 +0100, Sacha wrote:

On 2013-06-29 13:08:36 +0100, David Hill said:

On 29/06/2013 12:41, Janet wrote:
In article ,
lid says...

On Sat, 29 Jun 2013 11:35:00 +0100, rbel wrote:

On Sat, 29 Jun 2013 10:11:13 +0100, "Dave Smith"
wrote:

Article today in D Mail that it's not a good idea to feed birds during the
winter.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-2348635/Why-feeding-birds-winter-bad-Leaving-food-reduce-breeding-success-spring.html?ico=sciencetech^headlines




Having read the original paper when it was published last week I would
summarise it as an interesting but fairly limited study of one species
in a woodland environment. The focus was primarily on winter feeding
of fat supplements which had an apparent impact on reproductive and
fledgling success.

The possible causes for this were the survival through the winter of
potential parent birds who would not normally make it through to the
reproductive stage - thus poor reproductive success; insufficient
spring/summer food to support increased number of fledglings and
unbalanced diet resulting in imperfect eggs.

It did point out that all year round feeding could well reverse any
adverse impact and it did cite other research which indicated that
supplementary nuts led to increased fledgling success.

From watching the activity on our feeders there is no doubt that blue
tits tend to favour fat supplement over seed but also spend a lot of
time on the nut feeder.

Our tits gave low priority to the fat and went for the seeds. The fat
was only eaten when there were no seeds left. They are very fussy
about which seeds they will eat.

This could be a reflection on the quality/variety/age of the fat/seeds
offered.
We find that blue, coal and great tits are all avid feeders on
fatballs (with seed in)and right now, all their young are feeding there
too.

Janet.

If my "vultures" are anything to go by they eat almost everything that
is put out for them.
As I have said before I make my own bird food, Tesco value whole meal
bread (crumbed) dripping, Porridge oats and wild bird food seed mix
from the Range.
Apart from visiting adults I am feeding around a dozen families, as
foster dad I am left to look after and feed the children whilst Mum and
Dad are off having yet another family.
Yesterday was a record day, over lunch (Mine as well as theirs) I
counted 19 birds on the feeding station at one time with a lot more in
the sou rounding bushes and tees coming and going, with 9 birds in one
feeding station, and through all the chaos a greater spotted woodpecker
kept feeding oblivious to the sou rounding clamour.
David @ a sunny side of Swansea Bay.

Please note I made no reference to my great tits (something to do with
years of Zantac I believe)

We're finding the birds are *very* hungry. I can only guess that this
is because they've been raising and feeding chicks and with the cold
spring start, there are less insects around than normal at this time of
year. For the the first time ever, the rooks are trying to get seed
from the bird feeders. I must say they look utterly ridiculous, huge
as they are trying to cling onto those but at the same time, I feel
very sorry for them and very concerned. They're obviously quite
desperate to find food.

Be glad you haven't got jackdaws. They are smart enough to get food
from the feeders and working in teams they can empty a feeder in a
day.

We have a lot of jackdaws, doing the same thing and 'hoovering' the tea
room lawn after we've closed. It's just that we've never seen the rooks
trying this manoeuvre before!
--

Sacha
www.hillhousenursery.com
South Devon
www.helpforheroes.org.uk