Stephen wrote:

Some of the goldfish we lost where about 8inches long,
are they not too big for a grass snake to take?

I imagine they would be too big. Mind you, a female grass snake can grow to
over a metre long, so might be able to handle an 8-incher on a good day!

However, I think it's much more likely that a heron was the culprit.

A nylon net and/or trip wires are probably your best answer.

Incidentally, is your pond quite shallow at the edges? A deep pond deters
herons as they don't like to get their trousers wet. They like to wade into
shallow water.

I built a pond that had steep sides and no shallow areas. I only ever lost
fish to grass snakes.

--
Interloper

Hi Stephen, I would agree, a heron could land there easily and I bet thats whats had your fish. I often see people advised to 'give fish plenty of cover' to protect from herons but quite honestly, thats a waste of time. As an angler, I've watched herons fish on countless occasions and they stand like statues motionless until the fish swim past, then, as quick as lightening they strike and rarely miss ! Ive watched them take small eels as well and if you have ever handled (or tried to handle) eels, you'll know just how hard they are to grip but the heron has no trouble ? They are very patient hunters and once they find a pond, will return again and again until they have cleaned it out !
Lannerman.

wrote in message
...
We have a small pond which until recently had seven goldfish in
it, we have this year in particular built it up with plants to add
coverage and added a brick dry wall edging to replace the old cane
wall we originally had and added lilies which covers two thirds of
the pond which is about 2 feet deep at one end and about eighteen
inches at the other. We have also erected two pergolas, one
directly over the pond which has fine netting over the top to
discourage the odd heron etc and the other as a seating area.

We had until a few days ago seven goldfish, we only now have two
left, I had made a cover over the pond which was plastic netting
attached to garden cane to protect the fish but this year because
of the extra coverage of plants I removed the cover (it won't fit
now anyway due to the overgrown plants) but there had been
sufficient cover to protect them, or so I thought, the linked
photo's below will show very little flight path for a heron or
even a seagull to land and takeoff but we still lost five fish
over two days.

Any idea what might have nabbed the fish, or do you think it
possible for a flying predator to take the fish as there may not
have been sufficient coverage after all?

http://stephen.hull.mediacave.co.uk/example/pond1.jpg
http://stephen.hull.mediacave.co.uk/example/pond2.jpg
http://stephen.hull.mediacave.co.uk/example/pond3.jpg
http://stephen.hull.mediacave.co.uk/example/pond4.jpg

Stephen.


--
http://www.stephen.hull.btinternet.co.uk
From the Wirral Peninsula.
Coach painting tips and techniques + Land Rover colour codes
"Whatever is rightly done, however humble, is noble". Henry Royce

Grass snake unless they were very large in which case cat and we now have
otter problems!


--
Charlie, Gardening in Cornwall
Holders of National Collections of Clematis viticella
and Lapageria rosea cvs
http://www.roselandhouse.co.uk

In message
"Interloper" wrote:

wrote:

Our two remaining fish are traumatised lurking at the bottom
of the pond.

That's a typical indication of a heron having been in your pool.

Strange that there has been no evidence of a predator, like
damaged foliage, pond plants etc all left intact, the heron must
be very stealthy to leave to trace.

Stephen.

--
http://www.stephen.hull.btinternet.co.uk
From the Wirral Peninsula.
Coach painting tips and techniques + Land Rover colour codes
"Whatever is rightly done, however humble, is noble". Henry Royce

In message
"Interloper" wrote:

Stephen wrote:

Some of the goldfish we lost where about 8inches long,
are they not too big for a grass snake to take?

I imagine they would be too big. Mind you, a female grass snake can grow to
over a metre long, so might be able to handle an 8-incher on a good day!

However, I think it's much more likely that a heron was the culprit.

A nylon net and/or trip wires are probably your best answer.

Incidentally, is your pond quite shallow at the edges? A deep pond deters
herons as they don't like to get their trousers wet. They like to wade into
shallow water.

I built a pond that had steep sides and no shallow areas. I only ever lost
fish to grass snakes.

I spread a sprinkling of talcum powder down last night but it
rained and we still have the two fish left.
However today I've used some garden canes around the pond entwined
with twine, that should stop the heron or cat getting in.

The pond is deep at all the edges giving no purchase for something
to stand on, its straight in if they do.
I don't think there are any grass snakes round here as I've
not heard anyone mention them at all.

Stephen.

--
http://www.stephen.hull.btinternet.co.uk
From the Wirral Peninsula.
Coach painting tips and techniques + Land Rover colour codes
"Whatever is rightly done, however humble, is noble". Henry Royce

In message
"Charlie Pridham" wrote:


wrote in message
...
We have a small pond which until recently had seven goldfish in
it, we have this year in particular built it up with plants to add
coverage and added a brick dry wall edging to replace the old cane
wall we originally had and added lilies which covers two thirds of
the pond which is about 2 feet deep at one end and about eighteen
inches at the other. We have also erected two pergolas, one
directly over the pond which has fine netting over the top to
discourage the odd heron etc and the other as a seating area.

We had until a few days ago seven goldfish, we only now have two
left, I had made a cover over the pond which was plastic netting
attached to garden cane to protect the fish but this year because
of the extra coverage of plants I removed the cover (it won't fit
now anyway due to the overgrown plants) but there had been
sufficient cover to protect them, or so I thought, the linked
photo's below will show very little flight path for a heron or
even a seagull to land and takeoff but we still lost five fish
over two days.

Any idea what might have nabbed the fish, or do you think it
possible for a flying predator to take the fish as there may not
have been sufficient coverage after all?

http://stephen.hull.mediacave.co.uk/example/pond1.jpg
http://stephen.hull.mediacave.co.uk/example/pond2.jpg
http://stephen.hull.mediacave.co.uk/example/pond3.jpg
http://stephen.hull.mediacave.co.uk/example/pond4.jpg

Stephen.


--
http://www.stephen.hull.btinternet.co.uk
From the Wirral Peninsula.
Coach painting tips and techniques + Land Rover colour codes
"Whatever is rightly done, however humble, is noble". Henry Royce

Grass snake unless they were very large in which case cat and we now have
otter problems!


I am leaning toward the heron theory ATM, we don't have grass
snakes, otters, badgers or foxes in our gardens but we do have
cats and a heron has recently been seen in the area.

I'll see how the twine works before I restock with fish.

Thanks for all the replies.

Stephen.

--
http://www.stephen.hull.btinternet.co.uk
From the Wirral Peninsula.
Coach painting tips and techniques + Land Rover colour codes
"Whatever is rightly done, however humble, is noble". Henry Royce

On Aug 27, 6:36*pm, "Interloper" wrote:
"harry" wrote:

I have grass snakes. All my sticklebacks do seem to have disappeared.

Sticklebacks - fascinating fish; I haven't seen a stickleback for many
years. They have a wonderful defence against predators determined to eat
them. They rigidly erect their spines which stick into the predator's mouth
tissue, making it something of a challenge to swallow them. This usually
results in the stickleback being spat back out to swim again.
--
Interloper

I have vast shoals of sticklebacksor had. There is a lot of weed in
the pond so they may be lurking. Cod Winter? Grass snakes?
I have been encouraging our numerous grass snakes with nest sites and
hibernation pits.
We had lots of toad tadpoles but few frog tadpoles this year.
Our once numerous population of voles seems to have crashed. Haven't
seen heard one this year plus no little tunnels in the grass. Cold
Winter?

On Aug 27, 7:31*pm, wrote:
In message
* * * * * Dave Hill wrote:





wrote in message

...
We have a small pond which until recently had seven goldfish in
it, we have this year in particular built it up with plants to add
coverage and added a brick dry wall edging to replace the old cane
wall we originally had and added lilies which covers two thirds of
the pond which is about 2 feet deep at one end and about eighteen
inches at the other. We have also erected two pergolas, one
directly over the pond which has fine netting over the top to
discourage the odd heron etc and the other as a seating area.
We had until a few days ago seven goldfish, we only now have two
left, I had made a cover over the pond which was plastic netting
attached to garden cane to protect the fish but this year because
of the extra coverage of plants I removed the cover (it won't fit
now anyway due to the overgrown plants) but there had been
sufficient cover to protect them, or so I thought, the linked
photo's below will show very little flight path for a heron or
even a seagull to land and takeoff but we still lost five fish
over two days.
Any idea what might have nabbed the fish, or do you think it
possible for a flying predator to take the fish as there may not
have been sufficient coverage after all?
http://stephen.hull.mediacave.co.uk/example/pond1.jpg
http://stephen.hull.mediacave.co.uk/example/pond2.jpg
http://stephen.hull.mediacave.co.uk/example/pond3.jpg
http://stephen.hull.mediacave.co.uk/example/pond4.jpg
Stephen.
I am supprised you can ever see them with all that plant cover.
Looks as if a heron could stand outside and fish in quite easily,
but have you thought it could be a grass snake, they are partial
to fish.

They say you should have at least one third of the water area
covered but the outer plants have gone a bit mad.

I've not seen any snakes in our area at all ever, but that doesn't
mean we don't have any.

Stephen.

--http://www.stephen.hull.btinternet.co.uk
From the Wirral Peninsula.
Coach painting tips and techniques + Land Rover colour codes
"Whatever is rightly done, however humble, is noble". Henry Royce- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Best chance of spotting grass snakes is swimming in the pond.

On Aug 27, 7:34*pm, wrote:
In message
* * * * * "Interloper" wrote:





"'Mike'" wrote:

In our case never seen any grass snakes.

Doesn't mean they're not there - they're stealthy little devils!

A couple of acres of landscaped gardens with well mown lawns.
However, there is an Island in the middle of the pond where
Ducks, Moorhens and Coots have their nests and raise their chicks, grass
snakes like eggs don't they?

Grass snakes much prefer frogs, but will readily take fish instead. *I've
seen more grass snakes that I've seen frogs these past few years.

I don't know whether grass snakes take small eggs, but duck's, moorhen's and
coot's eggs would be too big for them to handle.

Some of the goldfish we lost where about 8inches long, are they
not too big for a grass snake to take?

Stephen.

--http://www.stephen.hull.btinternet.co.uk
From the Wirral Peninsula.
Coach painting tips and techniques + Land Rover colour codes
"Whatever is rightly done, however humble, is noble". Henry Royce- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Dunno. I would have thought so. Ideal size for heron.

On Aug 27, 8:33*pm, "Interloper" wrote:
wrote:

Our two remaining fish are traumatised lurking at the bottom
of the pond.

That's a typical indication of a heron having been in your pool.

Yes, agree.

On Aug 28, 10:41*am, wrote:
In message
* * * * * "Interloper" wrote:

wrote:

Our two remaining fish are traumatised lurking at the bottom
of the pond.

That's a typical indication of a heron having been in your pool.

Strange that there has been no evidence of a predator, like
damaged foliage, pond plants etc all left intact, the heron must
be very stealthy to leave to trace.



Herons have low cunning believe me. We have a regular visitor. He
often flies over doing a recci I reckon. Comes early in the
morning. Fishes until disturbed in our wildlife pond.
My other pond is concrete box over a meter deep. Never goes near that
one

In message
Janet wrote:

In article ,
says...
the linked
photo's below will show very little flight path for a heron or
even a seagull to land and takeoff

AFAIK, flying herons never land in water; they wade into water from land.
There's plenty of room to land on the lawn and stroll to the pond.


Janet.

I've added a bit more wire and wrapped them around a few more
garden canes, this should stop the heron at least until I can make
another net type cover.

Stephen.


--
http://www.stephen.hull.btinternet.co.uk
From the Wirral Peninsula.
Coach painting tips and techniques + Land Rover colour codes
"Whatever is rightly done, however humble, is noble". Henry Royce

In message
Martin wrote:

On Sun, 28 Aug 2011 10:41:38 +0100, wrote:

In message
"Interloper" wrote:

wrote:

Our two remaining fish are traumatised lurking at the bottom
of the pond.

That's a typical indication of a heron having been in your pool.

Strange that there has been no evidence of a predator, like
damaged foliage, pond plants etc all left intact, the heron must
be very stealthy to leave to trace.

Herons are very stealthy. I've never seen them leave a trace.

I think I have provided suitable protection above the pond for
now anyway, whilst underneath I have a large pottery pot with a
hole drilled in the base which is left on its side on the bottom
of the pond for them to hide in, hopefully offering the fish a bit
more protection.

Stephen.


--
http://www.stephen.hull.btinternet.co.uk
From the Wirral Peninsula.
Coach painting tips and techniques + Land Rover colour codes
"Whatever is rightly done, however humble, is noble". Henry Royce

In message
harry wrote:

On Aug 27, 8:33*pm, "Interloper" wrote:
wrote:

Our two remaining fish are traumatised lurking at the bottom
of the pond.

That's a typical indication of a heron having been in your pool.

Yes, agree.

So far so good, but I'll keep an eye out during this week before
adding a few more fish.

Stephen.


--
http://www.stephen.hull.btinternet.co.uk
From the Wirral Peninsula.
Coach painting tips and techniques + Land Rover colour codes
"Whatever is rightly done, however humble, is noble". Henry Royce

On 28-Aug-2011, "Charlie Pridham" wrote:

wrote in message
...
We have a small pond which until recently had seven goldfish in
it, we have this year in particular built it up with plants to add
coverage and added a brick dry wall edging to replace the old cane
wall we originally had and added lilies which covers two thirds of
the pond which is about 2 feet deep at one end and about eighteen
inches at the other. We have also erected two pergolas, one
directly over the pond which has fine netting over the top to
discourage the odd heron etc and the other as a seating area.

We had until a few days ago seven goldfish, we only now have two
left, I had made a cover over the pond which was plastic netting
attached to garden cane to protect the fish but this year because
of the extra coverage of plants I removed the cover (it won't fit
now anyway due to the overgrown plants) but there had been
sufficient cover to protect them, or so I thought, the linked
photo's below will show very little flight path for a heron or
even a seagull to land and takeoff but we still lost five fish
over two days.

Any idea what might have nabbed the fish, or do you think it
possible for a flying predator to take the fish as there may not
have been sufficient coverage after all?

http://stephen.hull.mediacave.co.uk/example/pond1.jpg
http://stephen.hull.mediacave.co.uk/example/pond2.jpg
http://stephen.hull.mediacave.co.uk/example/pond3.jpg
http://stephen.hull.mediacave.co.uk/example/pond4.jpg

Stephen.


--
http://www.stephen.hull.btinternet.co.uk
From the Wirral Peninsula.
Coach painting tips and techniques + Land Rover colour codes
"Whatever is rightly done, however humble, is noble". Henry Royce

Grass snake unless they were very large in which case cat and we now have
otter problems!

I live in London and am new to keeping a fish pond. Something is trying to
wreck my small pond and I suspect a cat or maybe a fox. Plant pots are
tipped over and rocks moved. I only have four shubunkins and they seem able
to hide well among the pots and plants and are very paranoid when I
approach, except at feeding time.

Doug.