Now look, I know this sounds silly but have you asked someone else to buy
new plants and plant them for you without you handling them even once?
Just
try it as an experiment. I am convinced for absolutely no scientific
reason whatsoever (which will give the brainy types here a good laugh)
that
some plants just don't 'like' some people. I absolutely adore lily of the
valley, even wear a perfume scented with them but in five gardens I have
failed totally to get them to grow, while friends of mine are almost
calling
them 'weeds'! I've heard of this sort of thing with other people and
other
plants and there appears to be absolutely no rhyme or reason for it.
I've taken the liberty of changing the header on this in the hope it will
attract some more helpful discussion for you.
--
Sacha


Are there different types of Lilly of the Valley?

They grow like a weed in our garden creeping across the gravel paths so they
have to be hoed.

Would you like us to bring some to you? I am in Torquay in October and would
with pleasure drop some roots in. They can be prepared now.

Mike



--
The Royal Naval Electrical Branch Association.
'THE' Association if you served in the Electrical Branch of the Royal Navy
Reunion Bournemouth August/September 2007 FULL. WAIT LIST OPERATING
www.rneba.org.uk to find your ex-Greenie mess mates
www.iowtours.com for all ex-Service Reunions. More being added daily
"Navy Days" Portsmouth 25th - 27th July 2008. RN Shipmates will have a Stand

On 30/8/07 09:15, in article , "Kate
Morgan" wrote:

snip

Now look, I know this sounds silly but have you asked someone else to buy
new plants and plant them for you without you handling them even once?
Just
try it as an experiment. I am convinced for absolutely no scientific
reason whatsoever (which will give the brainy types here a good laugh)
that
some plants just don't 'like' some people. I absolutely adore lily of the
valley, even wear a perfume scented with them but in five gardens I have
failed totally to get them to grow, while friends of mine are almost
calling
them 'weeds'! I've heard of this sort of thing with other people and
other
plants and there appears to be absolutely no rhyme or reason for it.
I've taken the liberty of changing the header on this in the hope it will
attract some more helpful discussion for you.
--
Sacha

you could be right there Sacha, I cannot grow sweet peas, now that is very
very silly :-)

kate

There you are! I do honestly wonder if it's hormonal or something. I
remember years ago someone telling me that women make excellent fly fishers
because there's something in their skin which attracts fish! And of course,
the line, running through the fingers, would be coated with whatever that
is. So, perhaps..... My lily of the valley 'thing' is particularly
irritating as we sell the darned things by the hundreds, including the very
beautiful pink one and it is maddening to see them going out of the nursery
happy in their little pots, knowing that the ones I've put in might throw
out the odd leaf if I'm really lucky! In fact, we've just cleared a space
in one particular area and the girl who helps in the garden has planted
Gladiolus papilio there. I think I'll ask her to put some lily of the
valley in and see if they take!


--
Sacha
http://www.hillhousenursery.co.uk
South Devon
(remove weeds from address)
'We do not inherit the earth from our ancestors, we borrow it from our
children.'

"Sacha" wrote in message
. uk...
On 30/8/07 09:15, in article , "Kate
Morgan" wrote:

snip

Now look, I know this sounds silly but have you asked someone else to
buy
new plants and plant them for you without you handling them even once?
Just
try it as an experiment. I am convinced for absolutely no scientific
reason whatsoever (which will give the brainy types here a good laugh)
that
some plants just don't 'like' some people. I absolutely adore lily of
the
valley, even wear a perfume scented with them but in five gardens I have
failed totally to get them to grow, while friends of mine are almost
calling
them 'weeds'! I've heard of this sort of thing with other people and
other
plants and there appears to be absolutely no rhyme or reason for it.
I've taken the liberty of changing the header on this in the hope it
will
attract some more helpful discussion for you.
--
Sacha

you could be right there Sacha, I cannot grow sweet peas, now that is
very
very silly :-)

kate

There you are! I do honestly wonder if it's hormonal or something. I
remember years ago someone telling me that women make excellent fly
fishers
because there's something in their skin which attracts fish! And of
course,
the line, running through the fingers, would be coated with whatever that
is. So, perhaps..... My lily of the valley 'thing' is particularly
irritating as we sell the darned things by the hundreds, including the
very
beautiful pink one and it is maddening to see them going out of the
nursery
happy in their little pots, knowing that the ones I've put in might throw
out the odd leaf if I'm really lucky! In fact, we've just cleared a space
in one particular area and the girl who helps in the garden has planted
Gladiolus papilio there. I think I'll ask her to put some lily of the
valley in and see if they take!


--
Sacha

Why not let her plant some of our variety, and then when it's going,
transplant some?

End and proof of your theory then.

Kindest regards

Mike


--
The Royal Naval Electrical Branch Association.
'THE' Association if you served in the Electrical Branch of the Royal Navy
Reunion Bournemouth August/September 2007 FULL. WAIT LIST OPERATING
www.rneba.org.uk to find your ex-Greenie mess mates
www.iowtours.com for all ex-Service Reunions. More being added daily
"Navy Days" Portsmouth 25th - 27th July 2008. RN Shipmates will have a Stand

On Aug 30, 5:51 am, "FarmI" ask@itshall be given wrote:

I have neither the skills nor the experience of gardening that the
vast majority of posters here have - but I can pick out a contrary
dishonest poster intent on a bitch fest a mile off...

The bitch fests types are easy to spot. It's the dodgy gardening info that
can be more of a problem for those who don't have a lot of experience.

I would agree with that. My gardening knowledge is slight but I do
know a few things. e.g. I was able to help Sacha with mildew a few
years ago as I too had a vine and had treated it. So, we all share
our experiences. I suspect that all of us know whose advice to trust
and whose to discard, I know I do.

Judith

In article .com,
" writes:
| On Aug 30, 5:51 am, "FarmI" ask@itshall be given wrote:
|
| I have neither the skills nor the experience of gardening that the
| vast majority of posters here have - but I can pick out a contrary
| dishonest poster intent on a bitch fest a mile off...
|
| The bitch fests types are easy to spot. It's the dodgy gardening info that
| can be more of a problem for those who don't have a lot of experience.
|
| I would agree with that. My gardening knowledge is slight but I do
| know a few things. e.g. I was able to help Sacha with mildew a few
| years ago as I too had a vine and had treated it. So, we all share
| our experiences. I suspect that all of us know whose advice to trust
| and whose to discard, I know I do.

One of the many reasons that this group is more reliable than the Web
is that completely nonsensical postings using get contradicted, and
you don't have to look elsewhere for conflicting information. A lot
of 'information' on the Web has been put together by people who know
more about presentation than the subject, are actually advertising
material, or are plain propaganda.

As I implied, "FarmI" should choose a subject on which he is fairly
knowledgeable and which is popular on the Web, and look around. When
giving courses, I often say "DON'T look at the Web - not even pages
written by apparently respectable people - and this is why". And I
can witness that the same is true of many of the areas where I know
quite a lot but do not advise on at work.


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

On 30/8/07 10:30, in article
,
" wrote:

On Aug 30, 5:51 am, "FarmI" ask@itshall be given wrote:

I have neither the skills nor the experience of gardening that the
vast majority of posters here have - but I can pick out a contrary
dishonest poster intent on a bitch fest a mile off...

The bitch fests types are easy to spot. It's the dodgy gardening info that
can be more of a problem for those who don't have a lot of experience.

I would agree with that. My gardening knowledge is slight but I do
know a few things. e.g. I was able to help Sacha with mildew a few
years ago as I too had a vine and had treated it. So, we all share
our experiences. I suspect that all of us know whose advice to trust
and whose to discard, I know I do.

Judith

I think this is where Nick has a good point about this group - not that I'm
anti Farm's idea of Googling and/or using books if she finds that helpful,
not at all. But in the end, what you get from those sources is what you get
condensed here. IOW, some of it will be useful to the individual and some
will be hopeless. But what we learn here, if we don't just dash in, ask one
question and dash off!, is whose advice is sound and whose isn't. AND
putting it all together can lead to further discovery for all of us. I know
that if we were growing veg there are certain people here who could run a
market garden if they wanted to, and I'd lean on them for advice. Same goes
for various other types of gardening and for wild flowers and wildlife.
There is an abundance of knowledge here, it's free and a very little
observation helps sort the wheat from the chaff, just to employ the perfect
cliché. ;-)

--
Sacha
http://www.hillhousenursery.co.uk
South Devon
(remove weeds from address)
'We do not inherit the earth from our ancestors, we borrow it from our
children.'

"Sacha" wrote in message
. uk...
On 30/8/07 06:14, in article
, "FarmI"
ask@itshall be given wrote:

I've even resorted to
ringing an expert called "The Paeony Lady" (she won't sell you any of her
stock till she either inspects the site or has a detailed description
including photos from prosective clients).

!!! That sounds like someone selling you an animal, not a plant! How
glorious!

That's what I thought too. Mad as a coot, I thought, but I can certainly
understand her approach.

I simply can't figure it out but
then I am not alone in that. I know a number of seriously good gardeners
and not one of us who lives outside the village can get our plants to
flower. I'm about to try some trace elements and I might mutter about
ripping them out as I give it to them to see if they take heed of the
threat.

I used to write a gardening column for a newspaper and mentioned the lack
of
flowers (in a humorous way) in one of my columns. I promptly got a call
from the chap who had bought our old Rectory in the village (where I
hadn't
planted any paeonies) and he told me that he'd planted heaps and they all
flowered even after only 4 months in the ground, after being trampled by
builders etc, etc ad nauseum. I nearly cried.



Now look, I know this sounds silly but have you asked someone else to buy
new plants and plant them for you without you handling them even once?
Just
try it as an experiment. I am convinced for absolutely no scientific
reason whatsoever (which will give the brainy types here a good laugh)
that
some plants just don't 'like' some people. I absolutely adore lily of the
valley, even wear a perfume scented with them but in five gardens I have
failed totally to get them to grow, while friends of mine are almost
calling
them 'weeds'! I've heard of this sort of thing with other people and
other
plants and there appears to be absolutely no rhyme or reason for it.
I've taken the liberty of changing the header on this in the hope it will
attract some more helpful discussion for you.

Actually that doesn't sound silly at all. I might get Himself to do it. He
can grow carrots and I can't even get the things to germinate. I take over
once he gets them up.

On 30/8/07 14:08, in article
, "FarmI"
ask@itshall be given wrote:

"Sacha" wrote in message
. uk...
snip
Now look, I know this sounds silly but have you asked someone else to buy
new plants and plant them for you without you handling them even once?
Just
try it as an experiment. I am convinced for absolutely no scientific
reason whatsoever (which will give the brainy types here a good laugh)
that
some plants just don't 'like' some people. I absolutely adore lily of the
valley, even wear a perfume scented with them but in five gardens I have
failed totally to get them to grow, while friends of mine are almost
calling
them 'weeds'! I've heard of this sort of thing with other people and
other
plants and there appears to be absolutely no rhyme or reason for it.
I've taken the liberty of changing the header on this in the hope it will
attract some more helpful discussion for you.

Actually that doesn't sound silly at all. I might get Himself to do it. He
can grow carrots and I can't even get the things to germinate. I take over
once he gets them up.


Let us know, won't you? ;-) A woman said just that about sowing parsley to
me the other day. She can't get it to germinate for love nor money whereas
her husband can grows scads of it. I told him he was a very lucky man
because obviously, he wears the trousers in their house!

--
Sacha
http://www.hillhousenursery.co.uk
South Devon
(remove weeds from address)
'We do not inherit the earth from our ancestors, we borrow it from our
children.'

"Nick Maclaren" wrote in message
...

In article .com,
" writes:
| On Aug 30, 5:51 am, "FarmI" ask@itshall be given wrote:
|
| I have neither the skills nor the experience of gardening that the
| vast majority of posters here have - but I can pick out a contrary
| dishonest poster intent on a bitch fest a mile off...
|
| The bitch fests types are easy to spot. It's the dodgy gardening
info that
| can be more of a problem for those who don't have a lot of
experience.
|
| I would agree with that. My gardening knowledge is slight but I do
| know a few things. e.g. I was able to help Sacha with mildew a few
| years ago as I too had a vine and had treated it. So, we all share
| our experiences. I suspect that all of us know whose advice to trust
| and whose to discard, I know I do.

One of the many reasons that this group is more reliable than the Web
is that completely nonsensical postings using get contradicted, and
you don't have to look elsewhere for conflicting information. A lot
of 'information' on the Web has been put together by people who know
more about presentation than the subject, are actually advertising
material, or are plain propaganda.

Yes there is all of that and much more on the Net, but there are also some
absolute gems out there.

As I implied, "FarmI" should choose a subject on which he is fairly
knowledgeable and which is popular on the Web, and look around.

Been there, done that, got the T-shirt. I am often outraged at what I see
in cyber space as there are clearly some extraordinarily dumb and truly
nasty people in the world but I am also very often delighted at what I find
and where the trail leads. I have a huge reference library but the Net is
one of the best things to which I have ever been exposed. It has opened up
a new world and has extended the range of issues I can follow or learn
about.

When
giving courses, I often say "DON'T look at the Web - not even pages
written by apparently respectable people - and this is why". And I
can witness that the same is true of many of the areas where I know
quite a lot but do not advise on at work.

Hmmmmm. If anyone told me that at a course I was attending, I'd be
appalled. It would say to me that you think I'm too dumb to make an
assessment of any information other than what you thought was suitable for
me. I'd immediately go off and do the exact opposite as I'd be curious as to
why you were trying to put limits on my exposure to information other than
what you chose for me to see/read. I'd wonder what ulterior motive you had.
Don't be too offended by that comment, I have worked in goverment for nearly
30 years and in that environment one is attuned and on the lookout for the
running of multiple agendas.

I see the Net as any being like any other form of information media. I can
read the Net equivalent of the tabloid press and/or I can read the Net
equivalent of the quality broadsheets. All sources of information have
their positives and their negatives. Its the assessing of the information
that is something I really enjoy just as I enjoy politics as one of the best
forms of spectator sport.

In article ,
"FarmI" ask@itshall be given writes:
|
| When
| giving courses, I often say "DON'T look at the Web - not even pages
| written by apparently respectable people - and this is why". And I
| can witness that the same is true of many of the areas where I know
| quite a lot but do not advise on at work.
|
| Hmmmmm. If anyone told me that at a course I was attending, I'd be
| appalled. It would say to me that you think I'm too dumb to make an
| assessment of any information other than what you thought was suitable for
| me.

Read what I posted again, and this time read ALL of it. If I did not
explain why, you would be correct - because I do, you are wrong.

If you are capable of assessing information in an area that you have
no experience of, few skills to work out for yourself, and are trying
to learn, you are either a subdeity or in direct contact with some sort
of deity. No human can do that.

I'd immediately go off and do the exact opposite as I'd be curious as to
| why you were trying to put limits on my exposure to information other than
| what you chose for me to see/read. I'd wonder what ulterior motive you had.

Where DID you get the idea that I put limits on such things? I merely
give advice. Several times, people have gone off done what you say,
and then come back to me and said "I see what you mean" - or sometimes
have quoted one of the more common myths to me, and I have tried to
explain why it is a myth (which usually requires mathematics or other
skills WAY beyond their abilities).

| Don't be too offended by that comment, I have worked in goverment for nearly
| 30 years and in that environment one is attuned and on the lookout for the
| running of multiple agendas.

I am not offended, but you have gone a long way down in my assessment
of your abilities.


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

"Nick Maclaren" wrote in message
"FarmI" ask@itshall be given writes:
|
| When
| giving courses, I often say "DON'T look at the Web - not even pages
| written by apparently respectable people - and this is why". And I
| can witness that the same is true of many of the areas where I know
| quite a lot but do not advise on at work.
|
| Hmmmmm. If anyone told me that at a course I was attending, I'd be
| appalled. It would say to me that you think I'm too dumb to make an
| assessment of any information other than what you thought was suitable
for | me.

Read what I posted again, and this time read ALL of it. If I did not
explain why, you would be correct - because I do, you are wrong.

I did read all of what you wrote. And it is not possible for me to be
wrong. It's not about you, it;s about me. Someone saying to me "this is
why you shouldn't do 'x'" wouldn't make any difference to me. I know myself
and I know what I would do if someone said that to me. I would still do the
opposite. I may not admit that I had done it and it may make my life as a
course participant more difficult (as I know from experience it certainly
could do) but I would still do it.

You may (in this imaginary situation) have no intention of implying that I
am dumb but that is how I would interprete such a comment. In that
circumstance, it is not possible for me to be "wrong" because it has
absolutley nothing to do with you or what you would have said. It is how I
know I would react. I've done it before and no doubt will do it again.

If you are capable of assessing information in an area that you have
no experience of, few skills to work out for yourself, and are trying
to learn, you are either a subdeity or in direct contact with some sort
of deity. No human can do that.

I agree. But that is irrelevant as it has nothing to do with what I would
do in this fantasy situation.

I'd immediately go off and do the exact opposite as I'd be curious as to
| why you were trying to put limits on my exposure to information other
than
| what you chose for me to see/read. I'd wonder what ulterior motive you
had.

Where DID you get the idea that I put limits on such things?

I didn't. I just told you how I would react. Where did you get the idea
that you know more about how I would react than I do myself?

I merely
give advice. Several times, people have gone off done what you say,
and then come back to me and said "I see what you mean" - or sometimes
have quoted one of the more common myths to me, and I have tried to
explain why it is a myth (which usually requires mathematics or other
skills WAY beyond their abilities).

| Don't be too offended by that comment, I have worked in goverment for
nearly
| 30 years and in that environment one is attuned and on the lookout for
the
| running of multiple agendas.

I am not offended, but you have gone a long way down in my assessment
of your abilities.

Well as you clearly didn't understand that I was writing about myself and
not you, I'll give you the benefit of the doubt still.

In article ,
"FarmI" ask@itshall be given writes:
|
| I did read all of what you wrote. And it is not possible for me to be
| wrong. It's not about you, it;s about me. ...

I misunderstood. I apologise.


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

"Nick Maclaren" wrote in message
"FarmI" ask@itshall be given writes:
|
| I did read all of what you wrote. And it is not possible for me to be
| wrong. It's not about you, it;s about me. ...

I misunderstood. I apologise.

No need at all to apologise Nick. If we had been in conversation we would
have clarified our differing understanding in a few brief words. We don't
have the same sort of luxury when we have to type it and go back and forth
in a thread. But thank you for the apology even if it wasn't needed.

In article
, FarmI
writes

The Martin and Rix books are reasonably good for plant
varieties but lack lots of other stuff and even their coverage on some
subjects is poor (eg their book on Roses).


Their tree one is nowhere near as good as the perennials or the shrub
books.
--
Janet Tweedy
Dalmatian Telegraph
http://www.lancedal.demon.co.uk