My husband is in the process of erecting a pergola in our garden, but I need
some advice

We have 4 upright posts - measuring 4" x 2" (height about 2 metres)

Have tried looking on the net to get an idea of the height, but can't find
anything.
I would like some help please with the following :

1. I don't want the pergola 2 metres high, but would like to know what would
be an ideal height?
2 Measurements required here :
a. what height above ground should posts be?
b. how much below ground?

2. Concreting posts into ground :
a. how many bags of sand and cement do we need ? the ratio ? should
the mixture be on the dry side ?

Can someone help with the above, as I need to get the sand and cement on
Friday afternoon for the weekend.

On Wed, 2 Apr 2003 14:17:43 +0100, "janet.bennett"
wrote:

My husband is in the process of erecting a pergola in our garden, but I need
some advice

They did just that on the new Channel 4 gardening programme last
night. Find someone who taped it or go in a shop and look at the
book!
Happy gardening
Pam in Bristol
pamdotmoore@virgindotnet

Yes, I saw the new gardening programme last night, but unfortunately they
don't quote the number of bags and sand and cement you need. Thanks for
advice.

I've posted the same question to the DIY newsgroup, and someone has
suggested 'ready mixed post stuff', but its about £5.00 a bag. Wanted to
know if anyone knew the amount of sand and cement I'd need, so that I can
compare prices. Once again thanks for advice.


janet.bennett" wrote in message
...
My husband is in the process of erecting a pergola in our garden, but I
need
some advice

We have 4 upright posts - measuring 4" x 2" (height about 2 metres)

Have tried looking on the net to get an idea of the height, but can't find
anything.
I would like some help please with the following :

1. I don't want the pergola 2 metres high, but would like to know what
would
be an ideal height?
2 Measurements required here :
a. what height above ground should posts be?
b. how much below ground?

2. Concreting posts into ground :
a. how many bags of sand and cement do we need ? the ratio ? should
the mixture be on the dry side ?

Can someone help with the above, as I need to get the sand and cement on
Friday afternoon for the weekend.

On Wed, 2 Apr 2003 14:17:43 +0100, "janet.bennett"
wrote:

My husband is in the process of erecting a pergola in our garden, but I need
some advice

We have 4 upright posts - measuring 4" x 2" (height about 2 metres)

Have tried looking on the net to get an idea of the height, but can't find
anything.
I would like some help please with the following :

1. I don't want the pergola 2 metres high, but would like to know what would
be an ideal height?
2 Measurements required here :
a. what height above ground should posts be?
b. how much below ground?

2. Concreting posts into ground :
a. how many bags of sand and cement do we need ? the ratio ? should
the mixture be on the dry side ?

Can someone help with the above, as I need to get the sand and cement on
Friday afternoon for the weekend.


Maybe these guys can help, they're in London:
http://www.grandscapes.co.uk/landscaping/pergolas.html

Bart

In article ,
janet.bennett wrote:
Yes, I saw the new gardening programme last night, but unfortunately they
don't quote the number of bags and sand and cement you need. Thanks for
advice.

I've posted the same question to the DIY newsgroup, and someone has
suggested 'ready mixed post stuff', but its about £5.00 a bag. Wanted to
know if anyone knew the amount of sand and cement I'd need, so that I can
compare prices. Once again thanks for advice.

See Cormaic's pages. One part of cement to 3-5 of aggregate is fine,
and you can use sharp sand instead of aggregate if you have to.

But my advice is NOT to use concrete at all! If you build a pergola
properly, it will support itself and you will not have trouble with
the concrete when planting or removing it.

A reasonable height is 2.25-2.5 metres - much lower and things growing
over it will strangle people as they walk through. What? You aren't
growing a Climbing Triffid? Don't bet on it ....

For that, you need the posts to go down about 75 cm, though more does
no harm. Concreting in only reduces that to about 60 cm, so you have
gained little. Leverage is proportional to the square of the distance.

I would recommend 3.3 metre posts, though you can easily bind two
2 metre ones together with galvanised wire. Don't rely on screws alone.


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

"janet.bennett" wrote in message
...
My husband is in the process of erecting a pergola in our garden, but I
need
some advice

We have 4 upright posts - measuring 4" x 2" (height about 2 metres)

Have tried looking on the net to get an idea of the height, but can't find
anything.
I would like some help please with the following :

1. I don't want the pergola 2 metres high, but would like to know what
would
be an ideal height?
2 Measurements required here :
a. what height above ground should posts be?
b. how much below ground?

I used 2.4m above ground and 0.9m below. I also found that 6" square oak was
hardly any dearer than pressure treated softwood, so I used that for the
uprights. I probably only needed 4" square for the strength, but, when I
tried some test pieces, they looked wrong.

2. Concreting posts into ground :
a. how many bags of sand and cement do we need ? the ratio ? should
the mixture be on the dry side ?

I didn't concrete, merely surrounded the posts with well-rammed gravel. Once
the top rails and corner braces are in place, the whole structure becomes
quite rigid. Six years later they are still standing firm.

Colin Bignell

Thanks for advice - very much appreciated.


"janet.bennett" wrote in message
...
My husband is in the process of erecting a pergola in our garden, but I
need
some advice

We have 4 upright posts - measuring 4" x 2" (height about 2 metres)

Have tried looking on the net to get an idea of the height, but can't find
anything.
I would like some help please with the following :

1. I don't want the pergola 2 metres high, but would like to know what
would
be an ideal height?
2 Measurements required here :
a. what height above ground should posts be?
b. how much below ground?

2. Concreting posts into ground :
a. how many bags of sand and cement do we need ? the ratio ? should
the mixture be on the dry side ?

Can someone help with the above, as I need to get the sand and cement on
Friday afternoon for the weekend.

"Nick Maclaren" wrote in message
...
In article ,
janet.bennett wrote:
Yes, I saw the new gardening programme last night, but unfortunately they
don't quote the number of bags and sand and cement you need. Thanks for
advice.


But my advice is NOT to use concrete at all! If you build a pergola
properly, it will support itself and you will not have trouble with
the concrete when planting or removing it.


Possibly, but you need to define "Properly"! ie crossmembers properly
jointed and srtucural corner bracers etc etc the top structure is then
locked and solid.

But IHMO that is all too much faff. Concrete in 4*4 verticles to 75cm and
bolt or screw the horizontals and you can forget about all the proper
jointing and cross bracing.

see http://www.pavingexpert.com/featur07.htm for the Oracles advice on the
matter! A bit over heavy for me, but strucurally spot on.

pk

In article ,
Paul Kelly wrote:
"Nick Maclaren" wrote in message
...
In article ,
janet.bennett wrote:
Yes, I saw the new gardening programme last night, but unfortunately they
don't quote the number of bags and sand and cement you need. Thanks for
advice.

But my advice is NOT to use concrete at all! If you build a pergola
properly, it will support itself and you will not have trouble with
the concrete when planting or removing it.

Possibly, but you need to define "Properly"! ie crossmembers properly
jointed and srtucural corner bracers etc etc the top structure is then
locked and solid.

I thought that he was asking about a pergola, not a component of an
assault course! No, I am not referring to that - all I have ever done
is to nail or screw the members to each other.

But IHMO that is all too much faff. Concrete in 4*4 verticles to 75cm and
bolt or screw the horizontals and you can forget about all the proper
jointing and cross bracing.

And then go and buy some plastic climbers to put up them - the curses
of the people who buy your house are not your concern.


I have built four such structures in the way that Colin Bignell and
I describe, and they never shifted. A couple were there for a decade
or so, too. The three that are still up are showing no signs of
movement - flexing, yes, but not permanent movement.

Oh, and I do climb on them when needing to do major work on the top,
and their flexing is small enough not to worry me, which is saying
something (I have very little middle-ear function).


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

"Paul Kelly" wrote in message
...

"Nick Maclaren" wrote in message
...
In article ,
janet.bennett wrote:
Yes, I saw the new gardening programme last night, but unfortunately
they
don't quote the number of bags and sand and cement you need. Thanks
for
advice.


But my advice is NOT to use concrete at all! If you build a pergola
properly, it will support itself and you will not have trouble with
the concrete when planting or removing it.


Possibly, but you need to define "Properly"! ie crossmembers properly
jointed and srtucural corner bracers etc etc the top structure is then
locked and solid.

In my case, 6" nails hammered into everything where bits crossed.

Colin Bignell

Xref: news7 uk.rec.gardening:132728

Regarding construction of a pergola there are instructions for doing
just that in the April copy of The Garden (RHS) page 299.
it says 20 - 25%of the upright should be embedded in the ground.
Hole 2 ft deep for a 9ft upright, 6 x 6.
Hole should be no wider than a spade's width.
Put a half brick or stone under the post, half fill with hardcore and
top up with concrete. It empnasises need to keep checking with a
spirit level etc.
Metal brackets are suggested to avoid lots of joinery.
Happy gardening
Pam in Bristol
pamdotmooreatvirgindotnet

Jan
I did made my pergola about two years ago and used one bag of Post-Fix (B&Q)
per upright! (Very easy to use!)

My posts are rock solid and have endured gales without movement of flexing!

Badger


"janet.bennett" wrote in message
...
My husband is in the process of erecting a pergola in our garden, but I
need
some advice

We have 4 upright posts - measuring 4" x 2" (height about 2 metres)

Have tried looking on the net to get an idea of the height, but can't find
anything.
I would like some help please with the following :

1. I don't want the pergola 2 metres high, but would like to know what
would
be an ideal height?
2 Measurements required here :
a. what height above ground should posts be?
b. how much below ground?

2. Concreting posts into ground :
a. how many bags of sand and cement do we need ? the ratio ? should
the mixture be on the dry side ?

Can someone help with the above, as I need to get the sand and cement on
Friday afternoon for the weekend.

"Little Badger" wrote in message
...
Jan
I did made my pergola about two years ago and used one bag of Post-Fix
(B&Q)
per upright! (Very easy to use!)

My posts are rock solid and have endured gales without movement of
flexing!

Badger

That is just what we used with the same results)

Ophelia

In article ,
Ophelia wrote:

"Little Badger" wrote in message
...
Jan
I did made my pergola about two years ago and used one bag of Post-Fix
(B&Q)
per upright! (Very easy to use!)

My posts are rock solid and have endured gales without movement of
flexing!

That is just what we used with the same results)

Flexing is primarily dependent on the gauge of the timer used, and has
little to do with how they are fixed into the ground. I tend to use
3x3" and 3x2", so they flex a bit. Mine have never moved, and I don't
use concrete of any sort.


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

Nick
My posts are 4" x 4" and are 9' long!

Rock solid with Post-Fix!

Badger


"Nick Maclaren" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Ophelia wrote:

"Little Badger" wrote in message
...
Jan
I did made my pergola about two years ago and used one bag of Post-Fix
(B&Q)
per upright! (Very easy to use!)

My posts are rock solid and have endured gales without movement of
flexing!

That is just what we used with the same results)

Flexing is primarily dependent on the gauge of the timer used, and has
little to do with how they are fixed into the ground. I tend to use
3x3" and 3x2", so they flex a bit. Mine have never moved, and I don't
use concrete of any sort.


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.