Quentin Grady wrote:
On 16 Jul 2003 06:51:51 -0500, Brian Sandle
wrote:

As I see it the only way he can get his corn

(natural strains)

and lifestyle back is if
the courts force Monsanto to reverse engineer the seed line AND
provide compensation for loss of revenue, loss of credibility in the
organic market, court costs, distress etc.

Such a solution seems fitting.

In the corn contamination example only some of the farmers

Percy Schmeiser's naturally developed canola strains handed down for
several generations of farming were confiscated by Monsanto when their
genes got into his crop.

pollinated by wind blown pollen due to lack of containment by Monsanto
with their GE corn. Now it seems reasonable that when they
confiscated the farmer's corn they confiscated all the corn including
uncontaminated seeds. Since Monsanto have the ability to produce a
pure strain of GE corn, they also have the ability to test for GE corn
and to return to the farmer a reasonable approximation of his non-GE
corn.

Let's say for argument sake that Monsanto was entitled to the corn
they contaminated back. While this is a bit like the owners of an oil
tanker polluting a coast line demanding the government return their
oil let us for the moment ignore that and get to the nitty gritty.

There is a strong legal precedent for Monsanto being forced to return
the uncontaminated seeds among the corn they confiscated ... every
last one of them ... or pay compensation. The point was established
when it was deemed right and correct that an agreement entitled a
person to have their pound of flesh did not entitle them to one drop
of blood.

I suppose it would require something like growing all the seeds
separately, protected from cross pollination, and testing each plant for
whether it is GE in any respect and saving the rest of the seed from the
non-GE plants.

I understand that GE genes have got into the wild Mexican corn.

New Zealand is rapidly approaching the end of a moratorium on GE testing -
October. New Zealand is also debating a tax on farmers to research animal
methane produciton greenhouse effect.

================================================== ==================

Is the spread of GM DNA controllable? No.

================================================== ==================
"Genetically Modified Corn Spreading to Protected Wild Corn
Despite Mexico's 3-year-old moratorium on the use of genetically
altered corn, scientists have detected genetically modified DNA in
wild maize in the mountains of the state of Oaxaca.

Wayward genes from genetically modified corn that is widely grown in
Canada and the United States are spreading in remote mountainous
regions of Mexico.

Up to 70% of wild Mexican maize now carries transgenes that could only
have come from genetically engineered crops. The transgenes, which
scientists borrow from viruses and bacteria, have been engineered into
GM crops."

Nature November 29, 2001;414:541-543

And:

http://www.i-sis.org.uk/CorporateSerfdom.php

"It gets worse. The selling point behind Roundup Ready is
that it is a glyphosphate-resistant strain. Spray on the herbicide and
you're left with nothing but Monsanto crops. However, after two years
application, glyphosphate-resistant volunteer corn plants begin to
flourish. This has led to the most bizarre Monsanto patent yet awarded. US
patent # 6,239,072 covers the practice of mixing glyphosphate with other
herbicides, and any premixture thereof. This patent has been awarded
despite the fact that mixing herbicides is what any sensible, thinking
farmer would naturally do, and has been doing, in the event of resistant
plants emerging. The patent also serves as a "de facto" admission of the
GM "superweed" problem and that Roundup technology lacks efficacy and
predictability. "

And what other things happen to the transgenic crops? Currently the
Minsitry of Agriculture in New Zealand have some gumption to resist
Monsanto. They are banning the sale of soy beans and corn in supermarkets
here, as an attempt to stem the spread of transgenic plants. I hope they
get correct any re-write of the regulations about disease or other
weaknesses in imported seeds.

When the transgenic genes jump out of a gene line however a disabling
`footprint' is left.

So who should be planning to pay a tax to search for robust non-GE wild
strains to dip back into?

And other mistakes? It was always claimed that GE genes would not jump out
by wind pollination.

Brian Sandle wrote:

Quentin Grady wrote:
On 16 Jul 2003 06:51:51 -0500, Brian Sandle
wrote:

As I see it the only way he can get his corn

(natural strains)

and lifestyle back is if
the courts force Monsanto to reverse engineer the seed line AND
provide compensation for loss of revenue, loss of credibility in the
organic market, court costs, distress etc.

Such a solution seems fitting.

In the corn contamination example only some of the farmers

Percy Schmeiser's naturally developed canola strains handed down for
several generations of farming were confiscated by Monsanto when their
genes got into his crop.

pollinated by wind blown pollen due to lack of containment by Monsanto
with their GE corn. Now it seems reasonable that when they
confiscated the farmer's corn they confiscated all the corn including
uncontaminated seeds. Since Monsanto have the ability to produce a
pure strain of GE corn, they also have the ability to test for GE corn
and to return to the farmer a reasonable approximation of his non-GE
corn.

Let's say for argument sake that Monsanto was entitled to the corn
they contaminated back. While this is a bit like the owners of an oil
tanker polluting a coast line demanding the government return their
oil let us for the moment ignore that and get to the nitty gritty.

There is a strong legal precedent for Monsanto being forced to return
the uncontaminated seeds among the corn they confiscated ... every
last one of them ... or pay compensation. The point was established
when it was deemed right and correct that an agreement entitled a
person to have their pound of flesh did not entitle them to one drop
of blood.

I suppose it would require something like growing all the seeds
separately, protected from cross pollination, and testing each plant for
whether it is GE in any respect and saving the rest of the seed from the
non-GE plants.

I understand that GE genes have got into the wild Mexican corn.

New Zealand is rapidly approaching the end of a moratorium on GE testing -
October. New Zealand is also debating a tax on farmers to research animal
methane produciton greenhouse effect.

================================================== ==================

Is the spread of GM DNA controllable? No.

================================================== ==================
"Genetically Modified Corn Spreading to Protected Wild Corn
Despite Mexico's 3-year-old moratorium on the use of genetically
altered corn, scientists have detected genetically modified DNA in
wild maize in the mountains of the state of Oaxaca.

Wayward genes from genetically modified corn that is widely grown in
Canada and the United States are spreading in remote mountainous
regions of Mexico.

Up to 70% of wild Mexican maize now carries transgenes that could only
have come from genetically engineered crops. The transgenes, which
scientists borrow from viruses and bacteria, have been engineered into
GM crops."

Nature November 29, 2001;414:541-543

And:

http://www.i-sis.org.uk/CorporateSerfdom.php

"It gets worse. The selling point behind Roundup Ready is
that it is a glyphosphate-resistant strain. Spray on the herbicide and
you're left with nothing but Monsanto crops. However, after two years
application, glyphosphate-resistant volunteer corn plants begin to
flourish. This has led to the most bizarre Monsanto patent yet awarded. US
patent # 6,239,072 covers the practice of mixing glyphosphate with other
herbicides, and any premixture thereof. This patent has been awarded
despite the fact that mixing herbicides is what any sensible, thinking
farmer would naturally do, and has been doing, in the event of resistant
plants emerging. The patent also serves as a "de facto" admission of the
GM "superweed" problem and that Roundup technology lacks efficacy and
predictability. "

And what other things happen to the transgenic crops? Currently the
Minsitry of Agriculture in New Zealand have some gumption to resist
Monsanto. They are banning the sale of soy beans and corn in supermarkets
here, as an attempt to stem the spread of transgenic plants. I hope they
get correct any re-write of the regulations about disease or other
weaknesses in imported seeds.

When the transgenic genes jump out of a gene line however a disabling
`footprint' is left.

So who should be planning to pay a tax to search for robust non-GE wild
strains to dip back into?

And other mistakes? It was always claimed that GE genes would not jump out
by wind pollination.

If one were to cross a tainted field corn with an original by simply planting them aternately,,,a rectified strain could be raised in about three years of continuous monitoring. ALSO the corn would have HUGE-long ears with giant kernals. The original cor
n brought to our Indian Nationss in about 800 BC by what they call: THE KATCHINA! They were reptoids from Eridanus ( 350 systems) who are vegetarians and live in a very "controlled' Empire! They are vegetarians and even the least planet is weather contr
olled...so much so that even windows are UN-necessary! No roads od powerlines as each home has an atomic powere source about the size of a football and it lasts for 3500 yrs. Since they ARE Vegetarians,,they cook in a "WOK"..YES! You simply cannot beat per
fection??
They have Grav-drive flying "pickup Trucks" as well! ( flat beds) LOL!
B-0b1

Where can I find a list of the persons/cases in which diagnosable
injury resulted from ingesting GE corn? Or medical journal reports?

--
Find Dzogvi Gzboli in www.google.com
or www.teoma.com

On Fri, 18 Jul 2003 08:59:34 -0700, Dzogvi Gzboli
wrote:

Where can I find a list of the persons/cases in which diagnosable
injury resulted from ingesting GE corn? Or medical journal reports?

Perhaps you should also ask where you can find scientific evidence
which proves that GE corn and GE soya are safe for humans, animals and
the environment?

regards
Marcus

On Fri, 18 Jul 2003 08:59:34 -0700, Dzogvi Gzboli
wrote:

Where can I find a list of the persons/cases in which diagnosable
injury resulted from ingesting GE corn? Or medical journal reports?

You are joking? Doesn't the inability to find such say something?

On 17 Jul 2003 20:09:04 GMT, Brian Sandle
wrote:

"It gets worse. The selling point behind Roundup Ready is
that it is a glyphosphate-resistant strain. Spray on the herbicide and
you're left with nothing but Monsanto crops. However, after two years
application, glyphosphate-resistant volunteer corn plants begin to
flourish. This has led to the most bizarre Monsanto patent yet awarded. US
patent # 6,239,072 covers the practice of mixing glyphosphate with other
herbicides, and any premixture thereof. This patent has been awarded
despite the fact that mixing herbicides is what any sensible, thinking
farmer would naturally do, and has been doing, in the event of resistant
plants emerging. The patent also serves as a "de facto" admission of the
GM "superweed" problem and that Roundup technology lacks efficacy and
predictability. "

So, don't buy Monsanto products, if you don't like them. No-one's
forcing anyone.