Torsten Brinch wrote in message
...
On Fri, 06 Dec 2002 20:56:37 +0000 (GMT),
("David G. Bell") wrote:

On Friday, in article

"Torsten Brinch" wrote:

On Fri, 6 Dec 2002 19:12:05 -0000, David P
wrote:

In article ,

says...
On Wed, 4 Dec 2002 23:23:24 -0600, "Gordon Couger"
wrote:



Farming is a cycical bussness. If we ran and hid at every down
market you
would be rather short on food.

But that isn't the point. UK had in 1996 a farm income peak,
the
highest in 20 years. The Times could see what would come after,
so why
couldn't the farmers.

How would you have managed the situation? Sold and run?

You mean, sell my hypothetical UK farmland? Hell no, David, no way,
not in 1996, just a few years after the CAP reform :-)

Hindsight is a wonderful thing, isn't it.

The Times didn't need hindsight to see what would come after, so why
should the farmers.


simple, the Times has done what every seer tries to do, it has
remembered the successful prophecy and the others are forgotten.


--
Jim Webster

"The pasture of stupidity is unwholesome to mankind"

'Abd-ar-Rahman b. Muhammad b. Khaldun al-Hadrami'

"David G. Bell" wrote in message
.. .
On Friday, in article

But you're only worth six feet of English soil, and as much more as
you
may be taller than other men.

I suspect that the danes no longer remember a Norse King,


--
Jim Webster

"The pasture of stupidity is unwholesome to mankind"

'Abd-ar-Rahman b. Muhammad b. Khaldun al-Hadrami'



--
David G. Bell -- SF Fan, Filker, and Punslinger.

"Let me get this straight. You're the KGB's core AI, but you're afraid
of a copyright infringement lawsuit over your translator semiotics?"
From "Lobsters" by Charles Stross.

""David G. Bell"" wrote in message
.. .

Hindsight is a wonderful thing, isn't it.

The *only* thing my 'farm management' lecturer taught me at college was
....

"If I had as much hindsight as foresight, then I'd be better by a darned
sight"


--
J B

On Sat, 7 Dec 2002 02:33:23 -0600, "Gordon Couger"
wrote:
"Torsten Brinch" wrote in message
news
On Wed, 4 Dec 2002 23:23:24 -0600, "Gordon Couger"
wrote:

If your governments are going to tie your farmers hands so he
can't make a profit they are pretty much obliged to keep him
in business

But our governments are not tying farmers hands so they can't make a
profit! ..

I will point out a few places that they are reaching deep in the farmers
purse.

Gordon points to a few of his usual suspects

Britain's farmers receive about £3 billion UKP in direct subsidies
and pricing support each year. Match that, if you can.

If you are gong
to pay the farmer get something you can use out of him.

I think you mean get -more- out of him for the money. But what?

You don't seem to care what WTO things anyway Take those idle
acres and put them to something you need.

Sorry, we can't do it if WTO says it is wrong. Commitments, you know.

Maybe you should close him down and put is stuff on display
and pay him a curator and by all you food from the low bidder.

Yes. -That- would be according to WTO rules, afaik.

Torsten Brinch wrote in message
...
On Sat, 7 Dec 2002 02:33:23 -0600, "Gordon Couger"
wrote:
"Torsten Brinch" wrote in message
news
On Wed, 4 Dec 2002 23:23:24 -0600, "Gordon Couger"
wrote:

If your governments are going to tie your farmers hands so he
can't make a profit they are pretty much obliged to keep him
in business

But our governments are not tying farmers hands so they can't make
a
profit! ..

I will point out a few places that they are reaching deep in the
farmers
purse.

Gordon points to a few of his usual suspects

Britain's farmers receive about £3 billion UKP in direct subsidies
and pricing support each year. Match that, if you can.


I think that you are a little behind in your understanding of recent US
agriculture policy

--
Jim Webster

"The pasture of stupidity is unwholesome to mankind"

'Abd-ar-Rahman b. Muhammad b. Khaldun al-Hadrami'

In article ,
says...
On Fri, 6 Dec 2002 22:14:20 -0000, David P
wrote:
you were impling that the people who were still
farming were short-sighted.

I was not. snipped the rest, all written under that misconception


Shame. I thought you might take the time to explain yourself.
--
David
Visit http://www.farm-direct.co.uk for your local farmgate food supplies.
FAQ's, Glossary, Farming Year and more!

In article , David P
writes
you were impling that the people who were still
farming were short-sighted.

I was not. snipped the rest, all written under that misconception


Shame. I thought you might take the time to explain yourself.

As things are getting a bit boring in here, perhaps we could extend this
discussion to include land tenure? I happen to know that Torsten has
strongly held, if slightly wacky, views on the subject.

Now if about six of us took him on .... :-)

regards

--
Tim Lamb

In article ,
says...
In article , David P
writes
you were impling that the people who were still
farming were short-sighted.

I was not. snipped the rest, all written under that misconception


Shame. I thought you might take the time to explain yourself.

As things are getting a bit boring in here, perhaps we could extend this
discussion to include land tenure? I happen to know that Torsten has
strongly held, if slightly wacky, views on the subject.

I believe I had noticed that. Pity he dropped out; I had planned on
asking him what a tenant farmer should have done once I was clear on what
his views on an owner-occupier was.

Now if about six of us took him on .... :-)

Ok - Jim can hold him while the other 5 hit him; or should that be
t'other way round?g
--
David
Visit http://www.farm-direct.co.uk for your local farmgate food supplies.
FAQ's, Glossary, Farming Year and more!

On Sat, 7 Dec 2002 19:44:39 -0000, David P
wrote:

In article ,
says...
On Fri, 6 Dec 2002 22:14:20 -0000, David P
wrote:
you were impling that the people who were still
farming were short-sighted.

I was not. snipped the rest, all written under that misconception


Shame. I thought you might take the time to explain yourself.

Try with a proper question.

On Sat, 7 Dec 2002 15:57:19 -0600, "Gordon Couger"
wrote:
You don't seem to care what WTO things anyway Take those idle
acres and put them to something you need.

Sorry, we can't do it if WTO says it is wrong. Commitments, you know.

You don't seem to give a damn about living up WTO rulings on beef in for a
penny in for a pound.

Which WTO ruling are you thinking of?

On Sat, 7 Dec 2002 21:51:22 +0000, Tim Lamb
wrote:

In article , David P
writes
you were impling that the people who were still
farming were short-sighted.

I was not. snipped the rest, all written under that misconception


Shame. I thought you might take the time to explain yourself.

As things are getting a bit boring in here, perhaps we could extend this
discussion to include land tenure?

No, first things first, Tim.
First we must out what it is David P has misunderstood.

On Saturday, in article

"David P" wrote:

In article ,
says...
In article , David P
writes
you were impling that the people who were still
farming were short-sighted.

I was not. snipped the rest, all written under that misconception


Shame. I thought you might take the time to explain yourself.

As things are getting a bit boring in here, perhaps we could extend this
discussion to include land tenure? I happen to know that Torsten has
strongly held, if slightly wacky, views on the subject.

I believe I had noticed that. Pity he dropped out; I had planned on
asking him what a tenant farmer should have done once I was clear on what
his views on an owner-occupier was.

Now if about six of us took him on .... :-)

Ok - Jim can hold him while the other 5 hit him; or should that be
t'other way round?g

Well, I just have to grease the left ankle torsion actuator bushes on
this Gundam, stuff the blonde wig in the tumble drier, and check the
cockpit fan....



--
David G. Bell -- SF Fan, Filker, and Punslinger.

"Let me get this straight. You're the KGB's core AI, but you're afraid
of a copyright infringement lawsuit over your translator semiotics?"
From "Lobsters" by Charles Stross.

Gordon Couger wrote in message
...


If they don't feel they need farmers why are they subsiding them?


here you confuse the EU and UK. Whenever there is a voluntary scheme,
the UK does not pay out on it, if the EU allow an extra top up if a
national government deems it necessary, the UK government doesn't deem
it necessary.

Love them or loathe them, If it wasn't for the EU there probably would
not be organised agriculture in the UK any more, a handful of really big
cereal operations and a lot of part time "ranching" of cattle and sheep
at no input stocking rates.


--
Jim Webster

"The pasture of stupidity is unwholesome to mankind"

'Abd-ar-Rahman b. Muhammad b. Khaldun al-Hadrami'


Gordon

"David G. Bell" wrote in message
.. .
On Saturday, in article


Well, I just have to grease the left ankle torsion actuator bushes on
this Gundam, stuff the blonde wig in the tumble drier, and check the
cockpit fan....

the only military system ever designed so that the pilot in his cockpit
could smile at his girl in the control tower as he took off.


--
Jim Webster

"The pasture of stupidity is unwholesome to mankind"

'Abd-ar-Rahman b. Muhammad b. Khaldun al-Hadrami'






--
David G. Bell -- SF Fan, Filker, and Punslinger.

"Let me get this straight. You're the KGB's core AI, but you're afraid
of a copyright infringement lawsuit over your translator semiotics?"
From "Lobsters" by Charles Stross.

On Sat, 7 Dec 2002 19:52:41 -0600, "Gordon Couger"
wrote:
"Torsten Brinch" wrote in message

Which WTO ruling are you thinking of?

The one on US beef.

There is a ruling that the beef hormone ban must be based on a risk
assessment, if that is what you are thunking of -- but the ban is
rather obviously based on a risk assessment. Indeed, on the thread
*EU confirms growth hormones pose health risk to consumers*
we discussed the most recent EU risk assessment in support of the ban,
on sci.agriculture only six months ago.