Jim Webster writes

don't encourage them Oz or they'll all want to be farm assured

Goody. How about right now?

--
Oz
This post is worth absolutely nothing and is probably fallacious.
Note: soon (maybe already) only posts via despammed.com will be accepted.

Jim Webster writes

Each animal has a passport and each passport would have to be filled in,
notifying the Ministry of the death of the animal and the passport
posted back to the Ministry.

Plus checking up to make sure they haven't made one or more mistakes
(which is common) and which are your fault, by definition.

--
Oz
This post is worth absolutely nothing and is probably fallacious.
Note: soon (maybe already) only posts via despammed.com will be accepted.

Jim Webster writes

I would prefer the latter as there are more regulators than cattle

I failed my assurance inspection.

Out of about 100 points I had:

1) A piece of render at ground level about 6"x2" had come off in the
dairy.

2) A pane of (wire reinforced) glass has a crack in it in the dairy.

These are considered a threat to public health ....

--
Oz
This post is worth absolutely nothing and is probably fallacious.
Note: soon (maybe already) only posts via despammed.com will be accepted.

Oz wrote in message
So, what does your government plan to do when all of your
country's ag
products are imported and war breaks out?

Simple: import it.

Food will always be really cheap, won't it?

LOL! Yeah, sure, and available too....

Absolutely.

surely you jest expression on face

The british government does not jest.

Unfortunately.

remember the British Government is composed of a lot of baby boomers for
who the concept of deprivation merely means not being able to buy
fashionable training shoes.
I think they assume they will be fed, as of right, should they ever be
hungry.

--
Jim Webster

"The pasture of stupidity is unwholesome to mankind"

'Abd-ar-Rahman b. Muhammad b. Khaldun al-Hadrami'

"Jim Webster" wrote in message
...

remember the British Government is composed of a lot of baby boomers for
who the concept of deprivation merely means not being able to buy
fashionable training shoes.
I think they assume they will be fed, as of right, should they ever be
hungry.

That's what it sounds like. I guess I consider self-sufficiency a part of
home-land security, which is all very important to on this side of the pond.
What is your government really focused on as far as security is concerned.
I don't know much, but y'all got me thinking about it and it seems they
aren't interested in self-sufficiency and aren't really interested in being
part of the EU (which might provide some sense of security), so what is
their plan as far as y'all can tell?

I'm not one for debating politics; just curious.

M

On 10/18/02 12:59 AM, in article , "Jim
Webster" wrote:


The UK governments policy now specifically says there is no strategic
need for food production. As far as anyone can work out, the UK
government has no real interest in any food production whatsoever.
Yet yesterday a foriegn office minister did say that we must take steps
to protect our strategic oil supplies, some of this is to source non-oil
energy sources.
--
Jim Webster

"The pasture of stupidity is unwholesome to mankind"

'Abd-ar-Rahman b. Muhammad b. Khaldun al-Hadrami'


U.S. Politicians aren't covering themselves with glory either.
American agriculture would shut down in a hurry without oil. The early
1970's oil embargo didn't leave a lasting enough impression. Research
spending to reach energy independence should rank at the top of the list
with defense spending.

Dean




-----= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =-----
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Dean Hoffman wrote in message
...


U.S. Politicians aren't covering themselves with glory either.
American agriculture would shut down in a hurry without oil. The
early
1970's oil embargo didn't leave a lasting enough impression. Research
spending to reach energy independence should rank at the top of the
list
with defense spending.

Dean


in the UK the Treasury is effectively blocking the use of bio-diesel
because of the level they have set the rate of tax. This means that the
UK is falling behind the rest of the EU never mind the rest of the
world.


--
Jim Webster

"The pasture of stupidity is unwholesome to mankind"

'Abd-ar-Rahman b. Muhammad b. Khaldun al-Hadrami'




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http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World!
-----== Over 80,000 Newsgroups - 16 Different Servers! =-----

Michelle Fulton wrote in message
. ..

"Jim Webster" wrote in message
...

remember the British Government is composed of a lot of baby boomers
for
who the concept of deprivation merely means not being able to buy
fashionable training shoes.
I think they assume they will be fed, as of right, should they ever
be
hungry.

That's what it sounds like. I guess I consider self-sufficiency a
part of
home-land security, which is all very important to on this side of the
pond.
What is your government really focused on as far as security is
concerned.
I don't know much, but y'all got me thinking about it and it seems
they
aren't interested in self-sufficiency and aren't really interested in
being
part of the EU (which might provide some sense of security), so what
is
their plan as far as y'all can tell?

I'm not one for debating politics; just curious.


as far as I can tell the only security they are interested in is their
own job security. The general working assumption is that the current
government wants to join the euro and get further into the EU. At the
moment it is beginning to look that the Germans effectively have
deflation. Deflation and no central bank is a bad combination. In the UK
the only thing that seems to be keeping us from deflation is the rise in
house prices which is not really sustainable. (At one time it was
considered ridiculous and unsustainable that a couple borrowed three and
a half times joint income to get a mortgage. Recently I have heard of
single people borrowing seven times their income, in mortgages to be
paid back over forty or fifty years. I am not sure I believe these
stories but they could be true.)
When the euro was introduced the Germans insisted on the a stability
pact, governments were not allowed to borrow more than 3% of spending.
This was an attempt to keep the currency strong. Now the French have
announced they are ignoring this, the Germans will not keep to it either
and senior Commissioners have announced the rule is silly and should be
scrapped. The Euro is going to be a weak currency and if the Irish vote
Yes to the Nice treaty it is going to be a larger, less well developed
area with a weak currency.
It may be that having a weak currency is actually a policy decision. It
would mean that Europeans could not afford to buy much in the way of
imports from outside the EU and would give them a more secure home
market. The obvious problem is that we buy a lot of raw materials from
outside the EU and we buy them in Dollars because that is what world
trading is done in. So we will have a situation where manufacturers are
1) buying in Dollars which will be a strong currency relative to the
euro
2) selling in Euros which is a weak currency
3) having to bear steadily increasing social costs.

We have had this in agriculture in the UK for the last three or four
years and it hurts.


--
Jim Webster

"The pasture of stupidity is unwholesome to mankind"

'Abd-ar-Rahman b. Muhammad b. Khaldun al-Hadrami'


M

----- Original Message -----
From: "Dean Hoffman"
Newsgroups: sci.agriculture
Sent: Friday, October 18, 2002 11:13 PM
Subject: Farming in South Dakota


: On 10/18/02 12:59 AM, in article , "Jim
: Webster" wrote:
:
:
: The UK governments policy now specifically says there is no strategic
: need for food production. As far as anyone can work out, the UK
: government has no real interest in any food production whatsoever.
: Yet yesterday a foriegn office minister did say that we must take steps
: to protect our strategic oil supplies, some of this is to source non-oil
: energy sources.
: --
: Jim Webster
:
: "The pasture of stupidity is unwholesome to mankind"
:
: 'Abd-ar-Rahman b. Muhammad b. Khaldun al-Hadrami'
:
:
: U.S. Politicians aren't covering themselves with glory either.
: American agriculture would shut down in a hurry without oil. The early
: 1970's oil embargo didn't leave a lasting enough impression. Research
: spending to reach energy independence should rank at the top of the list
: with defense spending.
:
Farming is using a great deal less fuel today than it did 20 years ago and
the rising tide of no till will decrease it further. When fuel is tight ag
has a very high priority.

As far a feeding the folks in the US we could shut down a large part of our
farming. 12,000,000 acres of cotton doesn't feed any one but cotton farmers.
A lot of wheat, corn and beans are for export.

In a really tight situation we could do like the UK with victory gardens in
WWII and save a very great deal of fuel. The Victory gardens were very
important to feeding the UK in just such a situation.

The UK will have to screw up really bad for the US to cut you off. Perhaps
taking up with the French might do it.

Gordon

Michelle Fulton writes

That's what it sounds like. I guess I consider self-sufficiency a part of
home-land security, which is all very important to on this side of the pond.
What is your government really focused on as far as security is concerned.
I don't know much, but y'all got me thinking about it and it seems they
aren't interested in self-sufficiency and aren't really interested in being
part of the EU (which might provide some sense of security), so what is
their plan as far as y'all can tell?

Plan?

PLAN?????!!!!

Are you mad?

They barely have a plan to win the next election.

Ten years ahead might just as well be mars.

--
Oz
This post is worth absolutely nothing and is probably fallacious.
Note: soon (maybe already) only posts via despammed.com will be accepted.

"Jim Webster" wrote in message
...

Michelle Fulton wrote in message
. ..

"Jim Webster" wrote in message
...

remember the British Government is composed of a lot of baby boomers
for
who the concept of deprivation merely means not being able to buy
fashionable training shoes.
I think they assume they will be fed, as of right, should they ever
be
hungry.

That's what it sounds like. I guess I consider self-sufficiency a
part of
home-land security, which is all very important to on this side of the
pond.
What is your government really focused on as far as security is
concerned.
I don't know much, but y'all got me thinking about it and it seems
they
aren't interested in self-sufficiency and aren't really interested in
being
part of the EU (which might provide some sense of security), so what
is
their plan as far as y'all can tell?

I'm not one for debating politics; just curious.


as far as I can tell the only security they are interested in is their
own job security. The general working assumption is that the current
government wants to join the euro and get further into the EU. At the
moment it is beginning to look that the Germans effectively have
deflation. Deflation and no central bank is a bad combination. In the UK
the only thing that seems to be keeping us from deflation is the rise in
house prices which is not really sustainable. (At one time it was
considered ridiculous and unsustainable that a couple borrowed three and
a half times joint income to get a mortgage. Recently I have heard of
single people borrowing seven times their income, in mortgages to be
paid back over forty or fifty years. I am not sure I believe these
stories but they could be true.)
When the euro was introduced the Germans insisted on the a stability
pact, governments were not allowed to borrow more than 3% of spending.
This was an attempt to keep the currency strong. Now the French have
announced they are ignoring this, the Germans will not keep to it either
and senior Commissioners have announced the rule is silly and should be
scrapped. The Euro is going to be a weak currency and if the Irish vote
Yes to the Nice treaty it is going to be a larger, less well developed
area with a weak currency.
It may be that having a weak currency is actually a policy decision. It
would mean that Europeans could not afford to buy much in the way of
imports from outside the EU and would give them a more secure home
market. The obvious problem is that we buy a lot of raw materials from
outside the EU and we buy them in Dollars because that is what world
trading is done in. So we will have a situation where manufacturers are
1) buying in Dollars which will be a strong currency relative to the
euro
2) selling in Euros which is a weak currency
3) having to bear steadily increasing social costs.

We have had this in agriculture in the UK for the last three or four
years and it hurts.

Hopefully better prices will hold up a while. I talked to a local gain
merchant and he says the higher wheat goes the less is for sale. He hasn't
started moving his stocks yet and wheat is 5.24 a bushel for export and corn
is $5 a bushel at the feed lot. He is 50 cents away from both in freight.

Hard money and expanding the EU into eastern Europe appear to me to be
mutually exclusive. Particularly at the outrageous tax rates and low
productivity rates in the EU. You can't have high wages, high living
standards, high taxes, high suicidal services, low cost products, lots of
free time and hard money in one package. Only farming, mining,
manufacturing, computer programming and similar industries create or enhance
wealth. Governments, health care, social services, and service industries
are leaches, ticks and fleas on the productive sector. We have to have some
of those services but we all need dipped.

I don't know about the off the books income in the EU. In the US it is
estimated to be 50 to 100% the size of the known income. The street price of
dope is high. Travelers tell me that cash does speak its own language in
Europe as it does most places so I expect it is a simulate situation.

The US government doesn't like small business becase so much of the money
misses the tax man. Governments would like a cashless society so they could
trace every dollar. Even then barter will beat the tax man. The government
really likes people that work for wages. They have them with no way out.
..

Gordon Couger wrote in message
...

The UK will have to screw up really bad for the US to cut you off.
Perhaps
taking up with the French might do it.


this is the really ridiculous part of the equation. The sort of people
who are against agricultural subsidy and see no point in agriculture are
also those who generally tend to be anti-American.
The journalists and commentators who wrote the "more in sorry than in
anger pieces" on September 12th saying "isn't it dreadful but the
Americans did have it coming" are often the same people who lobby
against agricultural support.



Bring back Gross Admiral Doenitz!


--
Jim Webster

"The pasture of stupidity is unwholesome to mankind"

'Abd-ar-Rahman b. Muhammad b. Khaldun al-Hadrami'

Oz wrote in message
...
Michelle Fulton writes

That's what it sounds like. I guess I consider self-sufficiency a
part of
home-land security, which is all very important to on this side of
the pond.
What is your government really focused on as far as security is
concerned.
I don't know much, but y'all got me thinking about it and it seems
they
aren't interested in self-sufficiency and aren't really interested in
being
part of the EU (which might provide some sense of security), so what
is
their plan as far as y'all can tell?

Plan?

PLAN?????!!!!

Are you mad?

They barely have a plan to win the next election.

Ten years ahead might just as well be mars.


actually, ask them for it and ten years ahead they will promise you
Mars.

For your vote in the next election they will promise you anything you
damned well want,
provided you are willing to wait ten years for it.


--
Jim Webster

"The pasture of stupidity is unwholesome to mankind"

'Abd-ar-Rahman b. Muhammad b. Khaldun al-Hadrami'


--
Oz
This post is worth absolutely nothing and is probably fallacious.
Note: soon (maybe already) only posts via despammed.com will be
accepted.

Gordon Couger wrote in message
...

as far as I can tell the only security they are interested in is
their
own job security. The general working assumption is that the current
government wants to join the euro and get further into the EU. At
the
moment it is beginning to look that the Germans effectively have
deflation. Deflation and no central bank is a bad combination. In
the UK
the only thing that seems to be keeping us from deflation is the
rise in
house prices which is not really sustainable. (At one time it was
considered ridiculous and unsustainable that a couple borrowed three
and
a half times joint income to get a mortgage. Recently I have heard
of
single people borrowing seven times their income, in mortgages to be
paid back over forty or fifty years. I am not sure I believe these
stories but they could be true.)
When the euro was introduced the Germans insisted on the a stability
pact, governments were not allowed to borrow more than 3% of
spending.
This was an attempt to keep the currency strong. Now the French have
announced they are ignoring this, the Germans will not keep to it
either
and senior Commissioners have announced the rule is silly and should
be
scrapped. The Euro is going to be a weak currency and if the Irish
vote
Yes to the Nice treaty it is going to be a larger, less well
developed
area with a weak currency.
It may be that having a weak currency is actually a policy decision.
It
would mean that Europeans could not afford to buy much in the way of
imports from outside the EU and would give them a more secure home
market. The obvious problem is that we buy a lot of raw materials
from
outside the EU and we buy them in Dollars because that is what world
trading is done in. So we will have a situation where manufacturers
are
1) buying in Dollars which will be a strong currency relative to the
euro
2) selling in Euros which is a weak currency
3) having to bear steadily increasing social costs.

We have had this in agriculture in the UK for the last three or four
years and it hurts.

Hopefully better prices will hold up a while. I talked to a local gain
merchant and he says the higher wheat goes the less is for sale. He
hasn't
started moving his stocks yet and wheat is 5.24 a bushel for export
and corn
is $5 a bushel at the feed lot. He is 50 cents away from both in
freight.

certainly makes UK price look a bit sick. That is probably why we can
export wheat to North Carolina :-((

Hard money and expanding the EU into eastern Europe appear to me to be
mutually exclusive. Particularly at the outrageous tax rates and low
productivity rates in the EU. You can't have high wages, high living
standards, high taxes, high suicidal services, low cost products, lots
of
free time and hard money in one package. Only farming, mining,
manufacturing, computer programming and similar industries create or
enhance
wealth. Governments, health care, social services, and service
industries
are leaches, ticks and fleas on the productive sector. We have to have
some
of those services but we all need dipped.

I don't know about the off the books income in the EU. In the US it is
estimated to be 50 to 100% the size of the known income. The street
price of
dope is high. Travelers tell me that cash does speak its own language
in
Europe as it does most places so I expect it is a simulate situation.

The US government doesn't like small business becase so much of the
money
misses the tax man. Governments would like a cashless society so they
could
trace every dollar. Even then barter will beat the tax man. The
government
really likes people that work for wages. They have them with no way
out.
.

certainly the civil service in the UK always used to tilt everything
against the self employed. In many agreements with other countries the
self employed weren't covered. Actually the EU has been better to the
self employed than the UK would be, indeed the EU has been better for
farming than the UK. In the EU there are still people in power who
regard farming as important. This state of affairs no longer exists in
the UK


--
Jim Webster

"The pasture of stupidity is unwholesome to mankind"

'Abd-ar-Rahman b. Muhammad b. Khaldun al-Hadrami'

"Jim Webster" wrote in message
...

Oz wrote in message
...
Plan?

PLAN?????!!!!

Are you mad?

They barely have a plan to win the next election.

Ten years ahead might just as well be mars.


actually, ask them for it and ten years ahead they will promise you
Mars.

For your vote in the next election they will promise you anything you
damned well want,
provided you are willing to wait ten years for it.

That is the problem with politics, isn't it. So many are willing to lie to
get your vote :-( Of course, democracy is the lesser of evils, but it would
be nice if people were honest!

M