Cass wrote in
:

In article , Unique Too
wrote:

I almost fell for your Lavender Dream suggestion, read all about
it, found a supplier, everything....

I don't know how Lavender Dream handles heat. It would be a shame if
it fades or crisps or something.

Could I ask who the supplier is, and whether they're willing to ship now?
Helpmefind lists various suppliers but I've had no luck finding anyone who
actually has it in stock.

----

saki wrote:

Cass wrote in
:

In article , Unique Too
wrote:

I almost fell for your Lavender Dream suggestion, read all about
it, found a supplier, everything....

I don't know how Lavender Dream handles heat. It would be a shame if
it fades or crisps or something.

Could I ask who the supplier is, and whether they're willing to ship now?
Helpmefind lists various suppliers but I've had no luck finding anyone who
actually has it in stock.

That's the rub. Unfortunately, it is a patent rose and the patent is
held by J & P. I don't know if they've ever released the rose. It is
available through Canadian suppliers. Their sites says they won't ship
to the US, but it happens. You can't keep a good rose secret. Imagine
if Outta the Blue came from Europe. That thing would be over here in a
heartbeat.

My plant was sold to me misidentified. It took a couple of years to
nail down what it really was. The patent will expire in a few more
years...until then, the only hope is to bomb J & P with emails to get
them to release the rose OR or hope for a supplier that has been
licensed.

It isn't lavender, btw. But it is on the mauve end of pink, certainly
not the bubble gum pink like Bonica.

A few years ago:
http://www.rosefog.us/imagesAtoI/BelindaShrub.jpg

This spring:
http://www.rosefog.us/imagesJtoZ/LavDreamMay03.jpg

A 24" spray on my mature plant:
http://www.rosefog.us/imagesJtoZ/LavDreamSpray.jpg

The foliage, showing how it handles PM:
http://home.earthlink.net/~cbernstei.../LDFoliage.jpg

On Sat, 02 Aug 2003 09:37:44 -0700, Cass
wrote:

saki wrote:

Cass wrote in
:

In article , Unique Too
wrote:

I almost fell for your Lavender Dream suggestion, read all about
it, found a supplier, everything....

I don't know how Lavender Dream handles heat. It would be a shame if
it fades or crisps or something.

Could I ask who the supplier is, and whether they're willing to ship now?
Helpmefind lists various suppliers but I've had no luck finding anyone who
actually has it in stock.

That's the rub. Unfortunately, it is a patent rose and the patent is
held by J & P. I don't know if they've ever released the rose. It is
available through Canadian suppliers. Their sites says they won't ship
to the US, but it happens. You can't keep a good rose secret. Imagine
if Outta the Blue came from Europe. That thing would be over here in a
heartbeat.

My plant was sold to me misidentified. It took a couple of years to
nail down what it really was. The patent will expire in a few more
years...until then, the only hope is to bomb J & P with emails to get
them to release the rose OR or hope for a supplier that has been
licensed.

It isn't lavender, btw. But it is on the mauve end of pink, certainly
not the bubble gum pink like Bonica.

A few years ago:
http://www.rosefog.us/imagesAtoI/BelindaShrub.jpg

This spring:
http://www.rosefog.us/imagesJtoZ/LavDreamMay03.jpg

A 24" spray on my mature plant:
http://www.rosefog.us/imagesJtoZ/LavDreamSpray.jpg

The foliage, showing how it handles PM:
http://home.earthlink.net/~cbernstei.../LDFoliage.jpg

Wow, now *that's* the sort of rose I've been looking for. I really
want a nice rounded mound of blooms to take up some room in my yard...

Any other suggestions along this line?

A quick Froogle (the "buying" part of google, at froogle.google.com) for "Lavender Dream rose" showed this site:
http://www.jhc-consulting.com/phr_info.htm for Peaceful Habitations Rose Gardens in San Antonio, Texas -- BUT according to the website,

"Unfortunately, we recently received notification from the Texas Department of Agriculture that Japanese Beetles have been reported somewhere in the State of Texas. A number of states are not currently infested, or are only partially infested, with Japanese Beetles, and we are not allowed to ship plants to those states until a control program for Japanese Beetles can be established here. Please refer to the following lists of states. If your state is listed, we will not be able to ship plants to you at this time. " List of states follows.

BTW, I confess that I was never a big fan of Texas (having met a few too many rabid Texans -- even before George W.), but I think that the state Ag. Dept. is doing the right thing here!

Anne Lurie
Raleigh, NC


"saki" wrote in message ...
Cass wrote in
:

In article , Unique Too
wrote:

I almost fell for your Lavender Dream suggestion, read all about
it, found a supplier, everything....

I don't know how Lavender Dream handles heat. It would be a shame if
it fades or crisps or something.

Could I ask who the supplier is, and whether they're willing to ship now?
Helpmefind lists various suppliers but I've had no luck finding anyone who
actually has it in stock.

----

In article , dave weil
wrote:

On Sat, 02 Aug 2003 09:37:44 -0700, Cass
wrote:

saki wrote:

Cass wrote in
:

In article , Unique Too
wrote:

I almost fell for your Lavender Dream suggestion, read all about
it, found a supplier, everything....

I don't know how Lavender Dream handles heat. It would be a shame if
it fades or crisps or something.

Could I ask who the supplier is, and whether they're willing to ship now?
Helpmefind lists various suppliers but I've had no luck finding anyone who
actually has it in stock.

That's the rub. Unfortunately, it is a patent rose and the patent is
held by J & P. I don't know if they've ever released the rose. It is
available through Canadian suppliers. Their sites says they won't ship
to the US, but it happens. You can't keep a good rose secret. Imagine
if Outta the Blue came from Europe. That thing would be over here in a
heartbeat.

My plant was sold to me misidentified. It took a couple of years to
nail down what it really was. The patent will expire in a few more
years...until then, the only hope is to bomb J & P with emails to get
them to release the rose OR or hope for a supplier that has been
licensed.

It isn't lavender, btw. But it is on the mauve end of pink, certainly
not the bubble gum pink like Bonica.

A few years ago:
http://www.rosefog.us/imagesAtoI/BelindaShrub.jpg

This spring:
http://www.rosefog.us/imagesJtoZ/LavDreamMay03.jpg

A 24" spray on my mature plant:
http://www.rosefog.us/imagesJtoZ/LavDreamSpray.jpg

The foliage, showing how it handles PM:
http://home.earthlink.net/~cbernstei.../LDFoliage.jpg

Wow, now *that's* the sort of rose I've been looking for. I really
want a nice rounded mound of blooms to take up some room in my yard...

Any other suggestions along this line?

Mounds are a function of winter pruning. By the end of the season,
there are always some angular canes sticking out.

The biggest mound of all: Sally Holmes. A little mound: The Fairy
(blooms finish badly on both, tho).

Another mound: Iceberg. http://www.rosefog.us/imagesAtoI/IcebergPot.jpg

How about Brilliant Pink Iceberg if you don't want white? Finishes
better than Iceberg, which is gross when the old blooms stick around.

How about Marjorie Fair
http://www.rosefog.us/imagesJtoZ/MarjorieFairPot.jpg

or Ballerina? Both will arch out and form a little mound. Ballerina is
a little more disease resistant here, and while it fades, it fades to
the clearest white. Like Marjorie Fair, it produces lots and lots of
little round hips. Add Yesterday, which is, I believe, the climbing
form, and you have an entire dynasty of roses derived from Ballerina
that have basically the same growth habit, clean foliage, and lots of
flowers.

Flower Girl is the latest decendant. The blooms are bigger, but the
flowering is constant.

On Sat, 02 Aug 2003 19:45:23 -0700, Cass
wrote:


Mounds are a function of winter pruning. By the end of the season,
there are always some angular canes sticking out.

I didn't mean to say that the mounds would stay mounded all year.

The biggest mound of all: Sally Holmes. A little mound: The Fairy
(blooms finish badly on both, tho).

I've got a Fairy climber and I'm happy with it, but the one Fairy that
I've seen in the bush form just looked like a little pink pom pom (and
then, only pink for a couple of times a year). That's not the look I'm
looking for.

Sally Holmes...hmmmm, that's a maybe, although I've seen some photos
that suggest that it can be a little sprawling...

Another mound: Iceberg. http://www.rosefog.us/imagesAtoI/IcebergPot.jpg

I don't know why I'm so prejudiced against this rose. Maybe because
it's so ubiquitous when it comes to catalogs and availability.
However, I don't ever seem to see them around, so maybe I shouldn't be
thinking that it's so ubiquitous out in the field. Maybe I should
reconsider. I could use some white, that's for sure.

How about Brilliant Pink Iceberg if you don't want white? Finishes
better than Iceberg, which is gross when the old blooms stick around.

I might just have a little too much pink right now chuckle.

How about Marjorie Fair
http://www.rosefog.us/imagesJtoZ/MarjorieFairPot.jpg

or Ballerina?

I just got one of these, but I'm growing it as a short climber on the
back side of the almost dead crabapple tree that I'm growing Don Juan
on (hoping to get an interesting visual contrast). I'm sort of hoping
that it wraps itself around the trunk a bit and fills out about 6 or 7
feet up.

I really like the clusters on that one. It's got a plesant mild smell
as well...

Both will arch out and form a little mound. Ballerina is
a little more disease resistant here, and while it fades, it fades to
the clearest white. Like Marjorie Fair, it produces lots and lots of
little round hips. Add Yesterday, which is, I believe, the climbing
form, and you have an entire dynasty of roses derived from Ballerina
that have basically the same growth habit, clean foliage, and lots of
flowers.

Flower Girl is the latest decendant. The blooms are bigger, but the
flowering is constant.

I found this under "Sea Pearl". Looks more like an upright bush in the
photo the find me site.

Thanks for the help.

Oh yeah, how about Phyllis Bide? I really like the look of yours. How
old is it? Is it "trained" around a framework or something?

BTW, my Portland from Glendorra is starting to get really big. It's
suffering from spots (that tree fungus that everyone has talked about
maybe), but the biggest "problem" is the fact that it's getting a
little top-heavy. Since it sits in some pretty windy conditions, it's
definitely been leaning due to likely root rock. I've propped it up on
the leaning side using a little stack ofbricks and I hope that this
will help it stabilize. Before I did this, it was leaning at about 30%
off vertical with the longest cane almost touching the ground. I
started trying using a broomstick, but that just didn't work...

I was told not to prune it the first year, which I didn't. I'm
guessing that I should prune it this fall, right? How far do you think
I should go?

As you can see, it's starting to get a little bit of a "rangey" look.
Earlier, it looked bushier.

Here are the most recent pics of it (the first two are from about 30
minutes ago):

http://www.pbase.com/image/19989586

http://www.pbase.com/image/19989546

This one's from April of this year:

http://www.pbase.com/image/19989612

Right now, it's about 5 1/2 feet tall. The earlier shot from April
shows it about 3 1/2 feet tall. I'd really like to keep that "compact"
upright bush shape and I guess I'll have to do that by prining, right?
Any hints?

Oh yeah, a reminder of the tiny little sprout that it came from, taken
probably around April of last year (and this is after it had doubled
in size g):

http://www.pbase.com/image/19989832

Cass wrote in
:

saki wrote:

Could I ask who the supplier is, and whether they're willing to ship
now? Helpmefind lists various suppliers but I've had no luck finding
anyone who actually has it in stock.

That's the rub. Unfortunately, it is a patent rose and the patent is
held by J & P. I don't know if they've ever released the rose. It is
available through Canadian suppliers. Their sites says they won't ship
to the US, but it happens. You can't keep a good rose secret....

Certainly true, and I think that this one fits the bill. I saw it growing
earlier this year at Descanso Gardens. It's quite striking and seems easy
to handle.

It isn't lavender, btw. But it is on the mauve end of pink, certainly
not the bubble gum pink like Bonica.

That'll harmonize nicely with my other mauves. As I recall Lavender Dream
also has a very nice light scent, something like mignonettes.

Perhaps I'll have to try some cuttings while waiting for a U.S. distributor
to get sensible.

Many thanks for the info.

----

Xref: 127.0.0.1 rec.gardens.roses:95330

In article , dave weil
wrote:

Oh yeah, how about Phyllis Bide? I really like the look of yours. How
old is it? Is it "trained" around a framework or something?

Yes, it's trained up a 4 x 4 post that has some 2 x 4's that form a
cross-like structure near the top.

| |
___|_|____
___|_|____
| |
| |

I don't know if this has the remotest chance of working...
but the 4 x 4 fits through the little square in the middle, as if were
coming straight at you.

You need 10 foot 4 x 4, about 2 1/2 in the ground in Quicrete.

But Phyllis Bide is truly a rambler, and not a mound. It looked like a
huge mound in the early years, but now it is...just huge:

http://home.earthlink.net/~cbernstei...es/Phyllis.jpg

Lots of fun to deadhead. *Now* I know why people grow it as an
espalier. Doh.

BTW, my Portland from Glendora is starting to get really big. It's
suffering from spots (that tree fungus that everyone has talked about
maybe), but the biggest "problem" is the fact that it's getting a
little top-heavy. Since it sits in some pretty windy conditions, it's
definitely been leaning due to likely root rock. I've propped it up on
the leaning side using a little stack ofbricks and I hope that this
will help it stabilize. Before I did this, it was leaning at about 30%
off vertical with the longest cane almost touching the ground. I
started trying using a broomstick, but that just didn't work...

I was told not to prune it the first year, which I didn't. I'm
guessing that I should prune it this fall, right? How far do you think
I should go?

I'd deadhead hard right now. In the fall, I wouldn't prune it,
exactly, but definitely top it by a foot or so if you haven't already
taken that much off already. I believe in topping roses where wind
damage is possible. It sure didn't generate growth around here when I
did it last December. Then next spring, I'd prune it at the regular
time.

I hear that the folk in SoCal say it does really well whacked hard,
like an oversized floribunda. I didn't hear that until too late to try
it last winter. I pegged down some droopy canes and pruned off all the
little twiggy growth, and the thing exploded. So definitely prune
Glendora (now correctly called Joasine Hanet) just the way you want it
to look.

As you can see, it's starting to get a little bit of a "rangey" look.
Earlier, it looked bushier.

Here are the most recent pics of it (the first two are from about 30
minutes ago):

http://www.pbase.com/image/19989586

http://www.pbase.com/image/19989546

Man, did that thing grow this year!

This one's from April of this year:

http://www.pbase.com/image/19989612

Isn't that cute?

Right now, it's about 5 1/2 feet tall. The earlier shot from April
shows it about 3 1/2 feet tall. I'd really like to keep that "compact"
upright bush shape and I guess I'll have to do that by pruning, right?
Any hints?

Mine gets rangy too.

Here how I pruned to remove lots of the laterals, especially at the
base:

http://home.earthlink.net/~cbernstei...ndoraJan03.jpg

And here's how rangey it was 6 months later, which was a month ago:
http://home.earthlink.net/~cbernstei...sineJuly03.jpg

Looking at the pruning photo, it's pretty clear that I could have cut
off at least 2/5's more in a half circle shape. I'll do that and more
this year. Mine is definitely wind blown.

I think we're both witnessing that Joasine Hanet is a lovely background
shrub. If we're going to have it as a specimen plant, we have to prune
harder.

Just my opinion this month.

On Mon, 04 Aug 2003 21:25:09 -0700, Cass
wrote:

In article , dave weil
wrote:

Oh yeah, how about Phyllis Bide? I really like the look of yours. How
old is it? Is it "trained" around a framework or something?

Yes, it's trained up a 4 x 4 post that has some 2 x 4's that form a
cross-like structure near the top.

| |
___|_|____
___|_|____
| |
| |

I don't know if this has the remotest chance of working...
but the 4 x 4 fits through the little square in the middle, as if were
coming straight at you.

You need 10 foot 4 x 4, about 2 1/2 in the ground in Quicrete.

But Phyllis Bide is truly a rambler, and not a mound. It looked like a
huge mound in the early years, but now it is...just huge:

http://home.earthlink.net/~cbernstei...es/Phyllis.jpg

Lots of fun to deadhead. *Now* I know why people grow it as an
espalier. Doh.

BTW, my Portland from Glendora is starting to get really big. It's
suffering from spots (that tree fungus that everyone has talked about
maybe), but the biggest "problem" is the fact that it's getting a
little top-heavy. Since it sits in some pretty windy conditions, it's
definitely been leaning due to likely root rock. I've propped it up on
the leaning side using a little stack ofbricks and I hope that this
will help it stabilize. Before I did this, it was leaning at about 30%
off vertical with the longest cane almost touching the ground. I
started trying using a broomstick, but that just didn't work...

I was told not to prune it the first year, which I didn't. I'm
guessing that I should prune it this fall, right? How far do you think
I should go?

I'd deadhead hard right now. In the fall, I wouldn't prune it,
exactly, but definitely top it by a foot or so if you haven't already
taken that much off already. I believe in topping roses where wind
damage is possible. It sure didn't generate growth around here when I
did it last December. Then next spring, I'd prune it at the regular
time.

I hear that the folk in SoCal say it does really well whacked hard,
like an oversized floribunda. I didn't hear that until too late to try
it last winter. I pegged down some droopy canes and pruned off all the
little twiggy growth, and the thing exploded. So definitely prune
Glendora (now correctly called Joasine Hanet) just the way you want it
to look.

As you can see, it's starting to get a little bit of a "rangey" look.
Earlier, it looked bushier.

Here are the most recent pics of it (the first two are from about 30
minutes ago):

http://www.pbase.com/image/19989586

http://www.pbase.com/image/19989546

Man, did that thing grow this year!

This one's from April of this year:

http://www.pbase.com/image/19989612

Isn't that cute?

Right now, it's about 5 1/2 feet tall. The earlier shot from April
shows it about 3 1/2 feet tall. I'd really like to keep that "compact"
upright bush shape and I guess I'll have to do that by pruning, right?
Any hints?

Mine gets rangy too.

Here how I pruned to remove lots of the laterals, especially at the
base:

http://home.earthlink.net/~cbernstei...ndoraJan03.jpg

And here's how rangey it was 6 months later, which was a month ago:
http://home.earthlink.net/~cbernstei...sineJuly03.jpg

Looking at the pruning photo, it's pretty clear that I could have cut
off at least 2/5's more in a half circle shape. I'll do that and more
this year. Mine is definitely wind blown.

I think we're both witnessing that Joasine Hanet is a lovely background
shrub. If we're going to have it as a specimen plant, we have to prune
harder.

Just my opinion this month.

Thanks for the pretty specific advice, When you say deadhead it hard,
are you saying that I should essentially give up the blooms at this
point of the season?

Did you strip the leaves or did that occur naturally?

BTW, we had a huge gale come in last night with 60 mile and hour
winds. Here's what the plant looks like today:

http://www.pbase.com/image/20022439

As you can see, some of the canes are horozontal or worse.

http://www.pbase.com/image/20022565

Here you can see the lean. I don't have enough bricks to keep it
upright it seems.

I've got a candidate for pegging (the one down on the ground in the
second picture), which I might just do and see what happens.

After seeing your picture of the more mature Portland/Joasine, I think
I'm going to let it go in that direction. I doesn't look like it wants
to grow in the shape that it was at in April. I *will* have to keep it
a bit pruned though, because, as you can see, it's pretty close to the
place where I park my car. Man, it should grow pretty close to Aloha,
that's for sure.

As to Phyllis - YIKES! Even though it isn't a mound anymore, I
wouldn't mind having something like that in my yard! Hmmmmm. Perhaps I
would plant it near the dead maple tree/Cecile Brunner.

And as to Baby Love. Here's a side view of the bush, clearly showing
the bush shape. You know, a couple of those at the entrance to a path,
or maybe at a walkway or steps, would be really cool.

http://www.pbase.com/image/20022774

In article , dave weil
wrote:

On Mon, 04 Aug 2003 21:25:09 -0700, Cass
wrote:

In article , dave weil
wrote:

Oh yeah, how about Phyllis Bide? I really like the look of yours. How
old is it? Is it "trained" around a framework or something?

Yes, it's trained up a 4 x 4 post that has some 2 x 4's that form a
cross-like structure near the top.

| |
___|_|____
___|_|____
| |
| |

I don't know if this has the remotest chance of working...
but the 4 x 4 fits through the little square in the middle, as if were
coming straight at you.

You need 10 foot 4 x 4, about 2 1/2 in the ground in Quicrete.

But Phyllis Bide is truly a rambler, and not a mound. It looked like a
huge mound in the early years, but now it is...just huge:

http://home.earthlink.net/~cbernstei...es/Phyllis.jpg

Lots of fun to deadhead. *Now* I know why people grow it as an
espalier. Doh.

BTW, my Portland from Glendora is starting to get really big. It's
suffering from spots (that tree fungus that everyone has talked about
maybe), but the biggest "problem" is the fact that it's getting a
little top-heavy. Since it sits in some pretty windy conditions, it's
definitely been leaning due to likely root rock. I've propped it up on
the leaning side using a little stack ofbricks and I hope that this
will help it stabilize. Before I did this, it was leaning at about 30%
off vertical with the longest cane almost touching the ground. I
started trying using a broomstick, but that just didn't work...

I was told not to prune it the first year, which I didn't. I'm
guessing that I should prune it this fall, right? How far do you think
I should go?

I'd deadhead hard right now. In the fall, I wouldn't prune it,
exactly, but definitely top it by a foot or so if you haven't already
taken that much off already. I believe in topping roses where wind
damage is possible. It sure didn't generate growth around here when I
did it last December. Then next spring, I'd prune it at the regular
time.

I hear that the folk in SoCal say it does really well whacked hard,
like an oversized floribunda. I didn't hear that until too late to try
it last winter. I pegged down some droopy canes and pruned off all the
little twiggy growth, and the thing exploded. So definitely prune
Glendora (now correctly called Joasine Hanet) just the way you want it
to look.

As you can see, it's starting to get a little bit of a "rangey" look.
Earlier, it looked bushier.

Here are the most recent pics of it (the first two are from about 30
minutes ago):

http://www.pbase.com/image/19989586

http://www.pbase.com/image/19989546

Man, did that thing grow this year!

This one's from April of this year:

http://www.pbase.com/image/19989612

Isn't that cute?

Right now, it's about 5 1/2 feet tall. The earlier shot from April
shows it about 3 1/2 feet tall. I'd really like to keep that "compact"
upright bush shape and I guess I'll have to do that by pruning, right?
Any hints?

Mine gets rangy too.

Here how I pruned to remove lots of the laterals, especially at the
base:

http://home.earthlink.net/~cbernstei...ndoraJan03.jpg

And here's how rangey it was 6 months later, which was a month ago:
http://home.earthlink.net/~cbernstei...sineJuly03.jpg

Looking at the pruning photo, it's pretty clear that I could have cut
off at least 2/5's more in a half circle shape. I'll do that and more
this year. Mine is definitely wind blown.

I think we're both witnessing that Joasine Hanet is a lovely background
shrub. If we're going to have it as a specimen plant, we have to prune
harder.

Just my opinion this month.

Thanks for the pretty specific advice, When you say deadhead it hard,
are you saying that I should essentially give up the blooms at this
point of the season?

No, but after a stem blooms, I'd cut the cane back 6, 8 inches. You
know there are people who cut every cane back to 18 inches to make then
thicker and stronger. Well, Glendora looks like she needs some
backbone.

Did you strip the leaves or did that occur naturally?

I strip every leaf off every rose every winter.

BTW, we had a huge gale come in last night with 60 mile and hour
winds. Here's what the plant looks like today:

http://www.pbase.com/image/20022439

As you can see, some of the canes are horozontal or worse.

http://www.pbase.com/image/20022565

Here you can see the lean. I don't have enough bricks to keep it
upright it seems.

I've got a candidate for pegging (the one down on the ground in the
second picture), which I might just do and see what happens.

After seeing your picture of the more mature Portland/Joasine, I think
I'm going to let it go in that direction. I doesn't look like it wants
to grow in the shape that it was at in April. I *will* have to keep it
a bit pruned though, because, as you can see, it's pretty close to the
place where I park my car. Man, it should grow pretty close to Aloha,
that's for sure.

Isn't that just like life. You're gonna let yours go all native and I'm
gonna discipline mine to look more like yours. The grass is always
greener...

As to Phyllis - YIKES! Even though it isn't a mound anymore, I
wouldn't mind having something like that in my yard! Hmmmmm. Perhaps I
would plant it near the dead maple tree/Cecile Brunner.

Oh, but you'd better check what the color looks like in the heat. Try
one of the Texas supplier websites and see their pix. Even tho I'm in
USDA zone 9, I'm in Heat zone 2 or 3. So colors are intense and dark
here.

And as to Baby Love. Here's a side view of the bush, clearly showing
the bush shape. You know, a couple of those at the entrance to a path,
or maybe at a walkway or steps, would be really cool.

http://www.pbase.com/image/20022774

Yep, that's just a nice, clean, leafy rose. Terrific.

On Wed, 06 Aug 2003 00:24:27 -0700, Cass
wrote:

As to Phyllis - YIKES! Even though it isn't a mound anymore, I
wouldn't mind having something like that in my yard! Hmmmmm. Perhaps I
would plant it near the dead maple tree/Cecile Brunner.

Oh, but you'd better check what the color looks like in the heat. Try
one of the Texas supplier websites and see their pix. Even tho I'm in
USDA zone 9, I'm in Heat zone 2 or 3. So colors are intense and dark
here.

It really wasn't the color that struck me - it was the size, shape and
profusion of blooms.

As if the lazy gardener that I am needs another deadheading excercise
in hell...

However, a rose that size would pretty much be out of proportion on my
lot, so I'm probably going to pass. Anything over about 8 - 10 feet
tall is just too big visually. My Aloha and Sweet Briar Rose are about
as big as I want to get. I don't mind big, but big horizontal is
probably preferable to big vertical, especially considering that I now
have two dead trees with climbers going up them already.
The crabapple will be particularly impressive in a few years (I hope)
because, in addition to the Ballerina and Don Juan from below, my Old
Blush climber now has canes that have reached the length to hang from
the higher branches. It's creating a sort of natural archway (if I can
maintain it - I *should* probably build a darned archway, but, hey,
the budget just won't allow it - it's strictly gardening on a
shoestring here at the weil household) Here's a shot:

http://www.pbase.com/image/20062844

I oversharpened it a little so that you could see the Old Blush canes
more clearly...

As to Glendorra, I really don't think that any amount of pruning would
keep that great shape from back in April, although I could be wrong,
as I often am. So, I think that I'm going sort of split the
difference. I *have* already taken the longest canes back a foot
though (except for the ones with buds on them...)

That's the rub. Unfortunately, it is a apparent rose and the apparent is held by J & P. I don't apperceive if they've anytime appear the rose. It is available through Canadian suppliers. Their sites says they will not ship to the US, but it happens. You can't accumulate a acceptable rose secret. Imagine if Outta the Blue came from Europe. That affair would be over actuality in a heartbeat.