Hi guys,
I posted this on rec.gardens but nobody responded. :-(
I hope my fellow rose people can help!

There is a link to a pic of an area of my garden at the end of the post.


I want to make it into a bbq area/sitting area at a low cost. My idea is

to remove all those weeds in that square area. Put down maybe a couple
of layers of newspaper, 1 layer of plastic weed block and cover it all
with a couple of inches of mulch.

The blue line is all the way to a lime tree that I can't remove.
So from that blue line it goes to the green line. At the end of the
green line is another tree (tree x) that has to stay. Between the lime
tree and tree x I was thinking of putting a 2 layer high stone wall.
Also from the lime tree to tree x it is not a straight line. Tree x is
about 2 feet in, so if I put a stone wall or a fence, a right angle will

occur. But looking at Home Depots website, it seems like a big job.
Having to dig down 12 inches for the first layer, etc etc. Plus the
expense of the stone blocks is a consideration.

For a visual effect, maybe I will put a picket fence in place of the
stone wall?

Link to the pic:http://dodgetrucks.org/cgi-bin/index.pl?photo=5668

Any suggestions from the group is appreciated.

Thanks,
Emil
--
Direct access to this group with http://web2news.com
http://web2news.com/?rec.gardens.roses

"Emil" wrote

Hi guys,
I posted this on rec.gardens but nobody responded. :-(
I hope my fellow rose people can help!

Hello Emil,

I took a look at your photo and I would like to suggest
something a bit different for that area. Indeed the first
thing to do is to get rid of the weeds, apply some pre-
emergent weed killer afterwards to make sure the
weeds don't come back and try to level the area to
the best of your ability. Instead of newspapers get
thee to an appliance store and ask if they would like
you to recycle for them their big cardboard boxes
where the appliances come in.

They are easier to work with, and a bit more rigid
than newspapers, you don't need to put any landscape
fabric -horrible stuff by the way, stay away from it -
and they will give you a better base for using pea
gravel, quarter minus to be precise which you can
order from any fuel company in your area or from
some construction supply place at very reasonable
price. Here in Oregon it is actually about the same
price as bark dust, better drainage and you can
make the place look a lot better without having
to worry about what kind of critters may make
a home in your barbecue area.

I was looking at the April issue of Sunset - I
don't normally buy it because their advertisement
is bigger than anything else but the cottage garden
cover got my eye. In page 104 there is a great
area designed by a Portland landscape designer
which shows raised beds framed with pine lumber.
Take a look at it. It may give you some idea so
you don't need to put the stone wall - everyone
and their godmother has one of those anyway -
and you can make some nifty raised beds where
to grow herbs and cutting flowers around the area
you are trying to improve.

You can make lasagna beds by actually extending
the cardboard all the way to where you want the
beds to go. Get a can of landscape paint and instead
of making it a square, go for a bit of a curve, or maybe
make two or three separate beds to surround the area
with the gravel in between, and mark them with the
landscape paint, that way it is easier to see what it
is going to look like in the future. Gravel is very clean
easy to hose down, if any stray weed finds its
way around, a shot of boiling water usually takes
care of business, and it is not an earwig motel
in the summer, or a lodge for them in the winter.

Hope this helps. You can get the staples that
are used to attach that horrible landscape fabric
to the ground and use those to steady your boards
before spreading the gravel. You would end finding
that it is easier to maintain and easier to live with
than barkdust.

Allegra

Emil! Its you! I was over there and I read your post and responded! I sent
you some trellis ideas. It looks like your home's walls would be a fantastic
support for climbing plants. The idea for a wall made of stone is more
costly than a small fence would be. Still with a wall if it was flat you
could have places to sit and set planters. I wonder if you could make a wall
from concrete block and then face it with something attractive like stone.
Jane
"Emil" wrote in message
...
Hi guys,
I posted this on rec.gardens but nobody responded. :-(
I hope my fellow rose people can help!

There is a link to a pic of an area of my garden at the end of the post.


I want to make it into a bbq area/sitting area at a low cost. My idea is

to remove all those weeds in that square area. Put down maybe a couple
of layers of newspaper, 1 layer of plastic weed block and cover it all
with a couple of inches of mulch.

The blue line is all the way to a lime tree that I can't remove.
So from that blue line it goes to the green line. At the end of the
green line is another tree (tree x) that has to stay. Between the lime
tree and tree x I was thinking of putting a 2 layer high stone wall.
Also from the lime tree to tree x it is not a straight line. Tree x is
about 2 feet in, so if I put a stone wall or a fence, a right angle will

occur. But looking at Home Depots website, it seems like a big job.
Having to dig down 12 inches for the first layer, etc etc. Plus the
expense of the stone blocks is a consideration.

For a visual effect, maybe I will put a picket fence in place of the
stone wall?

Link to the pic:http://dodgetrucks.org/cgi-bin/index.pl?photo=5668

Any suggestions from the group is appreciated.

Thanks,
Emil
--
Direct access to this group with http://web2news.com
http://web2news.com/?rec.gardens.roses

Emil wrote:

http://dodgetrucks.org/cgi-bin/index.pl?photo=5668

Emil, listen to Allegra and try to think curved, as if the drunken
stone mason or landscaper were in charge of the project and couldn't
walk a straight line for the CHP.

Can you help us out a bit with the N-S-E-W orientation of this garden?
Looks like the sun is coming from the south? or is that the West? Want
to put up a picture of what the view is looking away from the patio?

If your garden area is square or rectangular, draw the rectangle and
inside it, draw an amoeba. While the rectangle will represent your
fence, house and patio edge, the amoeba shape will represent your beds.
Even steps and walkways can look that way in very angular spaces: put
in flagstone from the landscape supply place instead of anything
perfectly round or square.

Not too much money? Scrounge. I've seen very handsome retaining walls
made of junk wood (eucalyptus comes to mind) inserted vertically like
soda straws side by side, protruding no more than a a foot or two. You
can do the same thing with 4 inch. pressure treated round poles.

Spend you money on tools. You can always use them. Follow the tree
trimmers around.

To visualize what plants will look like, sit on your patio and stick
your thumb in the air in front of you to block the things you want to
block. Then you can eyeball how tall your plants should be. Rule number
one for new plantings: s-h-r-u-b-s. Don't think you can fill the space
with six-packs of annuals. You will need to create a space and tone
with shrubs. Not to worry. Home Depot has many. Just be sure to buy the
ones right off the pallet from the supplied.

Rule number two: tall at the background, grading down to short in front.

Rule number three: use exotic shapes sparingly. Most good shrubs make
mounds, but there are wonderful landscape plants like Tasmanian tree
ferns that are very exotic and tropical. Don't use too many at once.

Hi Hi,

First off, I don't know if my first post was confusing or what. But I
don't want to build flower beds. I just want to make the area into a
sitting/bbq area.
So on to my replies...

Allegra thanks for the tip about the pea gravel! Wow, what a great
idea!!! I went to Home Depot and checked out some stuff. I am gonna buy
a couple of 50lb bags of pea gravel. Then I will buy a couple of
different bags of decorative rock to put on the pea gravel to make it
more attractive. I also found some trellis type fence material, it is 3
feet wide and 1 foot high. It will look nice in my opinion. I will put
the trellis into a concrete hole with a base so I can replace it if it
rots. Thanks to Allegra this will look alot better than mulch.

Allegra, what is the difference between using cardboard and using
newspaper? I own a clothing store, so getting cardboard isn't a problem.

Thanks for everybodys help so far!

Emil :-)
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Direct access to this group with http://web2news.com
http://web2news.com/?rec.gardens.roses

Emil requested information:

Allegra, what is the difference between using cardboard and using
newspaper? I own a clothing store, so getting cardboard isn't a problem.

Thanks for everybodys help so far!

Emil :-)
--

Hello Emil,

Newspaper tends to disintegrate faster than cardboard and
newspapers don't hold on to the weight of either soil, mulch
or gravel for example as well as cardboard does. In other
words, you would have to make the surface very flat and
if you plan to use newspapers the minimum amount to use
is between 4 to 6-inch in order to give you the stability
2 inches of cardboard will give you under foot. Make
sure to wet the cardboard well before adding the gravel
and if you want the gravel not to rock, then add about a
2-inch bed of sand, then add the gravel and it will take
a long time in your climate for that area to sink under
any kind of weight, be it walking, sitting or jumping ;)

And honestly I thought you were talking about making
some beds around the area and leave the middle or
the center for sitting. Go ahead and get that Sunset
anyway, it will give you some good ideas to create
that kind of space. Take a look at what they did with
gravel and some -I guess- 24-inch pavers. We did
something similar with fine river rock and put big
squares at an angle, then sprinkled the whole thing
with sky blue tumbled glass and more than once
we have been told that it looks as if petals have
fallen off even in winter. It is very useful and quite
attractive.

At any rate, good luck. I am sure with your spirit
and enthusiasm you will have that place in top shape
in no time flat.

Allegra

"Emil" wrote in message ...
Hi guys,
I posted this on rec.gardens but nobody responded. :-(
I hope my fellow rose people can help!

There is a link to a pic of an area of my garden at the end of the post.


I want to make it into a bbq area/sitting area at a low cost. My idea is

to remove all those weeds in that square area. Put down maybe a couple
of layers of newspaper, 1 layer of plastic weed block and cover it all
with a couple of inches of mulch.

The blue line is all the way to a lime tree that I can't remove.
So from that blue line it goes to the green line. At the end of the
green line is another tree (tree x) that has to stay. Between the lime
tree and tree x I was thinking of putting a 2 layer high stone wall.
Also from the lime tree to tree x it is not a straight line. Tree x is
about 2 feet in, so if I put a stone wall or a fence, a right angle will

occur. But looking at Home Depots website, it seems like a big job.
Having to dig down 12 inches for the first layer, etc etc. Plus the
expense of the stone blocks is a consideration.

For a visual effect, maybe I will put a picket fence in place of the
stone wall?

Link to the pic:http://dodgetrucks.org/cgi-bin/index.pl?photo=5668

Any suggestions from the group is appreciated.

Thanks,
Emil

I had a similar problem in my own garden where I wanted to create a
flat seating area on a slight slope with minimum costs. I dug out some
of the earth, but not to a great depth, lets not make this too
arduous. I then put down some plastic liner, which can be brought very
cheaply and log roll edging and filled the area with pebbles. I now
have may own beach. With a bench and grasses and hostas in pots and
some driftwood it looks great.