From what I've been reading here, I have some ponds that seem to be a bit
larger than most here. I've got three on this property, one in the front,
one in the back, and, you guessed it, one by the house in the middle. The
front and back ponds are the biggest, maybe an acre and a half to two acres
each. I'm guestimating from an aerial photograph, both ponds abut into an
overgrown swampy area I haven't been able to penetrate. The middle pond is
about 40-50 feet across, and from 3-5 feet deep, both depending on how much
rain we have had recently. The middle pond is surrounded by brush and
trees, but there are several places cut through the brush (and I'm bush
hogging more) where you can get right down to the water. The middle pond
has been used as a trash heap by the previous occupant. It's more like
yard debris, branches and stuff, but I have seen an old chair and barbecue
in there. There are frogs and snakes and stuff and I've even seen a big
ole turtle in there so it can't be *that* nasty. I don't know if there are
any fish. I do know there are fish in the back pond, I've seen them, lots
and lots of those mosquito eating fish, probably lots of other kinds too,
there is an old hand casting net back there. I'm gonna pull the trash out
of the middle pond and try to rehabilitate it. It is also the only pond I
have a prayer of getting power to. So are there any things I should or
shouldn't be doing in getting the pond ready? I live in Florida near
where I-75 and I-10 cross, so while it does freeze here, it only happens at
night and only a few times a winter.

Galen Hekhuis NpD, JFR, GWA
Illiterate? Write for FREE help

Courageous gave some good info. Invasive plants are bad in the south
and will take over in a single season, and most are vairtually
impossible to get rid of without a lot of work. Been there done that,
and never again........I am not finally parropts feather, water
hyacinth and frog bite free as far as I can tell. Cat tails and some
others are well under control and not a problem. I am located in south
central Alabama so were not all that much different in zone and
weather.

Are these ponds dug or are they merely formed by naturally occuring
depressions. I have a huge pond (natural depression) in my back area
thats probably 2 1/2 to 3 acres and it stays full of water about 8
months out of the year, the rest of the year it is just a
bog.......Your located around Swanney area by chance? Watch out of
cotton mouths and other bad types as well.

Aeration is highly suggested. If you do not aerate, you will get
heavy algae blooms, and then all it takes is a few overcast cloudy
days and the algae dies..........that night fish also die from oxygen
depravation........and at times it can go on for days and days.
Aeration will help with keeping algae down and your water well
oxygenated, and reduce your risk of a fish kill greatly.
I aerate my dug pond with a fountain and it took quite a few months of
playing with it until I can now say it has good, if not great water in
it, as compared to most southern natural or dug ponds......I actually
have visibility of 4 to 6 feet, all due to keeping excessive nutrients
out and providing lots of aeration. I use a submersible type pump to
pull water from the bottom and spray it over the surface. I also dose
with Baraclear P-80 which locks up phosphorous which algae needs to
have to utilize nitrogen to make it grow. Having a shallow pond as
such can have its draw backs, if relying on rainfall. My maina pond is
over 21 feet deep and is a bit over 1 acre in size. If you can build
up a berm around the majority of the pond y our wanting to estabish
first, it would help with runoff and adding excessive nutrients, but
it will also reduce your fill rate if your dependant on rain and
runoff, but once full if it does not leak, it will be a plus not
having all the runoff and excessive nutrients. Its gonna take you some
time but the efforts are worth it. I used to have bass, bream and
catfish in all my ponds, now my main pond has no bass, 3 albino
channel catfish, of 24" or better in length, and a few bream, which
are virtually impossible to get rid of, but I do have a heap of Koi
and various typs fo Goldfish in it. The other ponds still have the
assortments of bass, bream and cats and rarely if ever get much
attention like the main pond, but they are healthy none the less, but
lots of green water.

Lots of luck and keep us posted on your progress.........



On Fri, 24 Jun 2005 20:29:37 -0400, Galen Hekhuis
wrote:

===From what I've been reading here, I have some ponds that seem to be a bit
===larger than most here. I've got three on this property, one in the front,
===one in the back, and, you guessed it, one by the house in the middle. The
===front and back ponds are the biggest, maybe an acre and a half to two acres
===each. I'm guestimating from an aerial photograph, both ponds abut into an
===overgrown swampy area I haven't been able to penetrate. The middle pond is
===about 40-50 feet across, and from 3-5 feet deep, both depending on how much
===rain we have had recently. The middle pond is surrounded by brush and
===trees, but there are several places cut through the brush (and I'm bush
===hogging more) where you can get right down to the water. The middle pond
===has been used as a trash heap by the previous occupant. It's more like
===yard debris, branches and stuff, but I have seen an old chair and barbecue
===in there. There are frogs and snakes and stuff and I've even seen a big
===ole turtle in there so it can't be *that* nasty. I don't know if there are
===any fish. I do know there are fish in the back pond, I've seen them, lots
===and lots of those mosquito eating fish, probably lots of other kinds too,
===there is an old hand casting net back there. I'm gonna pull the trash out
===of the middle pond and try to rehabilitate it. It is also the only pond I
===have a prayer of getting power to. So are there any things I should or
===shouldn't be doing in getting the pond ready? I live in Florida near
===where I-75 and I-10 cross, so while it does freeze here, it only happens at
===night and only a few times a winter.
===
=== Galen Hekhuis NpD, JFR, GWA
=== Illiterate? Write for FREE help


==============================================
Put some color in your cheeks...garden naked!
"The original frugal ponder"
~~~~ }((((o ~~~~~~ }{{{{o ~~~~~~~ }(((((o

On Sat, 25 Jun 2005 18:18:07 -0700, Courageous
wrote:

You haven't mentioned what you want to achieve.

I haven't the foggiest what I can achieve. I just don't want to screw
things up.

Be that as it may, it's
my suspicion that you're going to need to talk to an expert for a water
feature of that size. Often, filtering with any formal techniques is nearly
impossible, unless you have a rich man's budget. More natural techniques
like appropriate planting are followed, as well as perhaps circulating the
water somehow, by adding whatever you can afford in the way of low pressure
high volume pumps (e.g., http://www.azponds.com, see the "Sequence" brand
pump for a good example of pumps to move maximum amounts of water for minimum
watts). Forget the idea of turning over your volume once hourly, that ain't
gonna happen here.

I imagine I'll get some sort of gas powered high volume pump to have
available should I ever have to use the pond as a reservoir for fire
fighting. I could power that virtually anywhere for a few hours. As for
electrically driven stuff, what with the distance and all I'll bet I can't
drive much over about 10 amps, total. I can probably supply that 24/7, the
local grid permitting. While power is pretty dependable here, I don't
think I'd plug in any life support systems...

Typically with large natural water features, from the reading I've done,
one of the very best things one can do is install a central fountain that
draws from the deepest point in the pond and blows it straight up out of
the water. This circulates the water at the bottom, which is ordinarily
quite stratified and very low in oxygen.

Far out. I think I can manage stuff like that.

The other thing that I'd say here is take care with some of the standard
water gardening plants (water lettuce, hyacinth, parrot feather), they are
likely quite invasive in your area and if they get established in your
pond, you'll have no end of headaches.

Both the front pond and the back pond have what I think is duckweed. The
front pond is almost covered by it now, the back pond (which gets a lot
more shade) seems to have halted at only about 10% coverage. The front
pond has a bunch of lily pads (the flowers are white with yellow centers,
they are supposed to be real common around here, I think they are very
pretty anyway) the back pond doesn't have any lily pads but it does have a
bunch of yellow canna plants along the side. The middle pond doesn't seem
to have any plants floating in it.

Thanks for the ideas. Like I say, I don't want to hear down the road:
"You should *never* have done that." I'm not real bright. I often have to
depend on others to tell me not to do stupid things.

Galen Hekhuis NpD, JFR, GWA
Illiterate? Write for FREE help

On Sat, 25 Jun 2005 01:40:55 GMT, (~Roy~) wrote:

Courageous gave some good info. Invasive plants are bad in the south
and will take over in a single season, and most are vairtually
impossible to get rid of without a lot of work. Been there done that,
and never again........I am not finally parropts feather, water
hyacinth and frog bite free as far as I can tell. Cat tails and some
others are well under control and not a problem. I am located in south
central Alabama so were not all that much different in zone and
weather.

Are these ponds dug or are they merely formed by naturally occuring
depressions. I have a huge pond (natural depression) in my back area
thats probably 2 1/2 to 3 acres and it stays full of water about 8
months out of the year, the rest of the year it is just a
bog.......Your located around Swanney area by chance? Watch out of
cotton mouths and other bad types as well.

The front pond is dug, I think. It looks kind of rectangular. Whatever
was done, it was done a long time ago. The rear pond is far too irregular
to have been dug, it has never changed level in the 8 months I've been
here, and, as it feeds a very small creek, I think there might be some sort
of spring in the bottom. The middle pond seems to be a classic "poorly
drained" depression. I see the water level in it fluctuate a lot. Yeah,
I'm not 3 miles from the Suwannee River, in beautiful Suwannee County,
elevation a stunning 145 feet, darn near on top of the world for Florida.

Aeration is highly suggested. If you do not aerate, you will get
heavy algae blooms, and then all it takes is a few overcast cloudy
days and the algae dies..........that night fish also die from oxygen
depravation........and at times it can go on for days and days.
Aeration will help with keeping algae down and your water well
oxygenated, and reduce your risk of a fish kill greatly.
I aerate my dug pond with a fountain and it took quite a few months of
playing with it until I can now say it has good, if not great water in
it, as compared to most southern natural or dug ponds......I actually
have visibility of 4 to 6 feet, all due to keeping excessive nutrients
out and providing lots of aeration. I use a submersible type pump to
pull water from the bottom and spray it over the surface. I also dose
with Baraclear P-80 which locks up phosphorous which algae needs to
have to utilize nitrogen to make it grow. Having a shallow pond as
such can have its draw backs, if relying on rainfall. My maina pond is
over 21 feet deep and is a bit over 1 acre in size. If you can build
up a berm around the majority of the pond y our wanting to estabish
first, it would help with runoff and adding excessive nutrients, but
it will also reduce your fill rate if your dependant on rain and
runoff, but once full if it does not leak, it will be a plus not
having all the runoff and excessive nutrients. Its gonna take you some
time but the efforts are worth it. I used to have bass, bream and
catfish in all my ponds, now my main pond has no bass, 3 albino
channel catfish, of 24" or better in length, and a few bream, which
are virtually impossible to get rid of, but I do have a heap of Koi
and various typs fo Goldfish in it. The other ponds still have the
assortments of bass, bream and cats and rarely if ever get much
attention like the main pond, but they are healthy none the less, but
lots of green water.

Do those floating solar powered fountains do any good? I imagine they just
take water from near the surface and squirt it up in the air. It seems
like the loss from evaporation might offset any good they do in stirring
things up. A berm is pretty much out of the question. Impossible in the
case of the front and back ponds and a real engineering project for the one
in the middle.

I'm an old cave explorer, and I know that underground drainage is more
often like a sewer than the glittering limestone caves a lot of people
think of. I'm right on the northern edge of a limestone ridge that runs
from here to south of Ocala. There is some world-class cave diving right
here in N Florida. I am reluctant to put any chemical in the ground or
water. Hell, I'm even kind of embarrassed to have a septic system, I'm
working on that.

Lots of luck and keep us posted on your progress.........

Thanks for your help. I will not only burden you all with reports now and
then, if I can figure out how to do so I'll also put up some pictures on a
website and give y'all the URL.

Galen Hekhuis NpD, JFR, GWA
Illiterate? Write for FREE help

On Sat, 25 Jun 2005 19:35:49 -0700, Courageous
wrote:


Both the front pond and the back pond have what I think is duckweed.

Once you have your water into a healthy state (aerated, circulated,
clear), you can add Koi and other fish that think duckweed is really
nummy. Don't buy big koi, just a bunch of cheap fingerlings.

If you get a grow out problem with main plants, you might consider
looking into neutered grass carp from your local water authority
or provider.

pond has a bunch of lily pads (the flowers are white with yellow centers,
they are supposed to be real common around here, I think they are very
pretty anyway) the back pond doesn't have any lily pads but it does have a
bunch of yellow canna plants along the side. The middle pond doesn't seem
to have any plants floating in it.

Once you have the various ponds all cleared out and in good shape
(that middle one in particular), you should plant it. Water lillies
in particular are very good choices. If they proliferate a bit, all
the better. They provide shade to the water below, preventing algae
from getting needed sunlight.

As for that middle pond, remove the junk, but don't disturb the soil.
In particular, remove metal junk. While your pond is large, and therefore
diffuses contaminants quite well, many kinds of metals are actually
toxic to fish... copper (including bronze and brass) in particular.

Thanks for the ideas. Like I say, I don't want to hear down the road:
"You should *never* have done that." I'm not real bright. I often have to
depend on others to tell me not to do stupid things.

Hah. It's the smart ones that always do the stupid things.

C//

Thanks for the comments again.

Galen Hekhuis NpD, JFR, GWA
Illiterate? Write for FREE help

I like this book
EARTH PONDS SOURCEBOOK by Tim Matson

kathy :-) www.blogfromthebog.com
this week ~ Mosquitoes!
Run For Your Life!

Pond 101 page for new pond keepers ~
http://hometown.aol.com/ka30p/myhomepage/garden.html

Ditto on what courageous wrote.
Unless you go the big bucks route for a bank of large solar panels and
batterys to have a power source for the solar pumps they do nor run
long enough or are strong enough to do much good. Strictly solar
powerd ones run only during daylight hours, and do little at night
when aeration is a most vital part.

Pardon my spelling "Swanney"........heck I new better but for the life
of me could not get that name to spell right so I let it bump.......So
since your in that area you just may find a gator someday in your pond
as well.

On Sat, 25 Jun 2005 22:01:02 -0700, Courageous
wrote:

===
===Do those floating solar powered fountains do any good?
===
===No. One option is to get an airpump and put a pond-sized airstone at
===the bottom of the pond. It's not the air bubbles, but rather the
===induced air current, that cause the aeration. The surface of the
===pond is a big air-exchanger, and bringing the low oxygen water from
===the bottom of the pond to the top, where the air is, does the trick.
===
===C//


==============================================
Put some color in your cheeks...garden naked!
"The original frugal ponder"
~~~~ }((((o ~~~~~~ }{{{{o ~~~~~~~ }(((((o

On Sat, 25 Jun 2005 13:18:21 GMT, (~Roy~) wrote:



Ditto on what courageous wrote.
Unless you go the big bucks route for a bank of large solar panels and
batterys to have a power source for the solar pumps they do nor run
long enough or are strong enough to do much good. Strictly solar
powerd ones run only during daylight hours, and do little at night
when aeration is a most vital part.

Pardon my spelling "Swanney"........heck I new better but for the life
of me could not get that name to spell right so I let it bump.......

No sweat. Actually, Stephen C. Foster never even saw the Suwannee River,
he was writing about the Pee Dee River in South Carolina, but Pee Dee
didn't sound so good, hence another river was chosen for the song.

So
since your in that area you just may find a gator someday in your pond
as well.

I moved here from farther south in the state, down around Dunnellon, about
90 mi north of Tampa. Being a fla****er-type of kayaker, I have been
rather close to several many gators down here. I've gotten to where we can
at least get along together.

Galen Hekhuis NpD, JFR, GWA
Illiterate? Write for FREE help

have a prayer of getting power to. So are there any things I should or
shouldn't be doing in getting the pond ready?

You haven't mentioned what you want to achieve. Be that as it may, it's
my suspicion that you're going to need to talk to an expert for a water
feature of that size. Often, filtering with any formal techniques is nearly
impossible, unless you have a rich man's budget. More natural techniques
like appropriate planting are followed, as well as perhaps circulating the
water somehow, by adding whatever you can afford in the way of low pressure
high volume pumps (e.g., http://www.azponds.com, see the "Sequence" brand
pump for a good example of pumps to move maximum amounts of water for minimum
watts). Forget the idea of turning over your volume once hourly, that ain't
gonna happen here.

Typically with large natural water features, from the reading I've done,
one of the very best things one can do is install a central fountain that
draws from the deepest point in the pond and blows it straight up out of
the water. This circulates the water at the bottom, which is ordinarily
quite stratified and very low in oxygen.

The other thing that I'd say here is take care with some of the standard
water gardening plants (water lettuce, hyacinth, parrot feather), they are
likely quite invasive in your area and if they get established in your
pond, you'll have no end of headaches.


C//

Both the front pond and the back pond have what I think is duckweed.

Once you have your water into a healthy state (aerated, circulated,
clear), you can add Koi and other fish that think duckweed is really
nummy. Don't buy big koi, just a bunch of cheap fingerlings.

If you get a grow out problem with main plants, you might consider
looking into neutered grass carp from your local water authority
or provider.

pond has a bunch of lily pads (the flowers are white with yellow centers,
they are supposed to be real common around here, I think they are very
pretty anyway) the back pond doesn't have any lily pads but it does have a
bunch of yellow canna plants along the side. The middle pond doesn't seem
to have any plants floating in it.

Once you have the various ponds all cleared out and in good shape
(that middle one in particular), you should plant it. Water lillies
in particular are very good choices. If they proliferate a bit, all
the better. They provide shade to the water below, preventing algae
from getting needed sunlight.

As for that middle pond, remove the junk, but don't disturb the soil.
In particular, remove metal junk. While your pond is large, and therefore
diffuses contaminants quite well, many kinds of metals are actually
toxic to fish... copper (including bronze and brass) in particular.

Thanks for the ideas. Like I say, I don't want to hear down the road:
"You should *never* have done that." I'm not real bright. I often have to
depend on others to tell me not to do stupid things.

Hah. It's the smart ones that always do the stupid things.

C//

Do those floating solar powered fountains do any good?

No. One option is to get an airpump and put a pond-sized airstone at
the bottom of the pond. It's not the air bubbles, but rather the
induced air current, that cause the aeration. The surface of the
pond is a big air-exchanger, and bringing the low oxygen water from
the bottom of the pond to the top, where the air is, does the trick.

C//