I have come to the conclusion that raccoons are picking up bad habits
from humans.
This is the third time this year that I have found a
disemboweled bull frog on my deck when I came out in the morning. I
would not mind as much if they were eaten, that's nature. But to kill
for the hell of it, that's human nature.
Plants are trashed, rocks moved but no fish harmed. They are
not even frightened.(still hand feeding)
Well! The trap is set again. This will be #4 this year. I
think I will just leave it set all year.

Hank Pagel wrote:
This is the third time this year that I have found a
disemboweled bull frog on my deck when I came out in the morning. I
would not mind as much if they were eaten, that's nature. But to kill
for the hell of it, that's human nature.
Plants are trashed, rocks moved but no fish harmed ...

This is a definite sign of raccoon -- they often pick tomatoes, apples,
pull carrots, beets, then take one bite, decide it's not quite what they
were looking for (ala Goldilocks!!) and move on to the next "taste test."

That bullfrog probably wasn't quite what the raccoon was hoping to eat
last night, so it was discarded. Good luck with the 4th trapping.
--
Kathy B

On Sat, 19 Jul 2003 12:02:01 -0400
"Hank Pagel" wrote:

I have come to the conclusion that raccoons are picking up bad habits
from humans.
This is the third time this year that I have found a
disemboweled bull frog on my deck when I came out in the morning. I
would not mind as much if they were eaten, that's nature. But to kill
for the hell of it, that's human nature.
Plants are trashed, rocks moved but no fish harmed. They are
not even frightened.(still hand feeding)
Well! The trap is set again. This will be #4 this year. I
think I will just leave it set all year.

It ain't necessarily only /human/ behavior. Ever seen a well-fed house
cat with a mouse?

Cybe R. Wizard -pounce and strike!

HP (Sat, 19 Jul 2003 12:02:01 -0400):
Well! The trap is set again. This will be #4 this year.

Had a chimp-sized raccoon (and mate). Caught it mid-night, chased
it up a red oak. Turned on the 500 watter, got the hose with jet
stream nozzle. Sprayed the sucker for about 30 minutes, up and
down the 30 ft tree. The mate got worried and came back (I think
the male offered himself by going up the tree and let the mate get
away by ground). She was blinded by the light and didn't see me.
Very weird when she stood up. Back to the male up the tree and
very soaked. He slowly came down, and I kept the spray on. Down
some more. Spray still. When he made it to the lowest limb he
looked exhausted. I stopped. He left. Haven't seen them since
(last year). And they were around for several years before this.

So, just show them who's boss! ahah

--
'`'`'`'`'`'`'`'`'`'`'`'`'`'`'`'`'`''`'`'`'`'`'`'`' `'`'`''`'`'`'`'`'`'`'
SLOTHEAD

Hank,
I'm sorry about the havoc they are creating! They can be extrememly
pesking, and quite dexterous! You might be on to something with your
analogy. They definitely SEEM to act like little kids.

I think raccoons were messing a bit with my barrel last night- things just
seem a bit amiss, like a bite size missing piece from a leaf. So far until
perhaps now, they had left the barrel alone (after they ate all the fish &
ransacked the hyancinth, which I got rid of). Soon, I'll restock with fish.
But it's maddening because the plants are the expensive part! (I get 12
cent goldfish).

Good luck with #4!

"Hank Pagel" wrote in message
...
I have come to the conclusion that raccoons are picking up bad habits
from humans.
This is the third time this year that I have found a
disemboweled bull frog on my deck when I came out in the morning. I
would not mind as much if they were eaten, that's nature. But to kill
for the hell of it, that's human nature.
Plants are trashed, rocks moved but no fish harmed. They are
not even frightened.(still hand feeding)
Well! The trap is set again. This will be #4 this year. I
think I will just leave it set all year.

Actually Humans act very much like other mammals. "Playing" is part of the
system and it is used to learn skills. All mammals have a cortex and depend
to some degree or another on learning. Mammals nurture their young, care
for other's young, will kill under various circumstances, have wide variance
in personality and behavior, etc.. I believe it was Jane Goodall that
observed a young chimp making friends with a monkey (different species).
Another chimp in the troop with a rather unpleasant personality then killed
the "friend" and ate it. We humans do not have a monopoly on either our
best or our worse personality traits.

What greatly disturbs me is that we are wiping out habitat at the rate the
land mass of a small city every single day. We push wildlife out of their
homes and then complain when they seek refuge in "our" territory. I may
bitch when the kingfisher swoops down and eats my favorite comet but I
appreciate its right to do so. That doesn't mean that I don't build my pond
in a manner (steep sides and deep) to keep the raccoons from tearing it
apart or that I don't wave the heron perching in the tree away after
enjoying its beauty.
DK


"Hank Pagel" wrote in message
...
I have come to the conclusion that raccoons are picking up bad habits
from humans.
This is the third time this year that I have found a
disemboweled bull frog on my deck when I came out in the morning. I
would not mind as much if they were eaten, that's nature. But to kill
for the hell of it, that's human nature.
Plants are trashed, rocks moved but no fish harmed. They are
not even frightened.(still hand feeding)
Well! The trap is set again. This will be #4 this year. I
think I will just leave it set all year.

Hank,
I'm sorry about the havoc they are creating! They can be extrememly
pesking, and quite dexterous! You might be on to something with your
analogy. They definitely SEEM to act like little kids.

I think raccoons were messing a bit with my barrel last night- things just
seem a bit amiss, like a bite size missing piece from a leaf. So far until
perhaps now, they had left the barrel alone (after they ate all the fish &
ransacked the hyancinth, which I got rid of). Soon, I'll restock with fish.
But it's maddening because the plants are the expensive part! (I get 12
cent goldfish).

Good luck with #4!

"Hank Pagel" wrote in message
...
I have come to the conclusion that raccoons are picking up bad habits
from humans.
This is the third time this year that I have found a
disemboweled bull frog on my deck when I came out in the morning. I
would not mind as much if they were eaten, that's nature. But to kill
for the hell of it, that's human nature.
Plants are trashed, rocks moved but no fish harmed. They are
not even frightened.(still hand feeding)
Well! The trap is set again. This will be #4 this year. I
think I will just leave it set all year.

Actually Humans act very much like other mammals. "Playing" is part of the
system and it is used to learn skills. All mammals have a cortex and depend
to some degree or another on learning. Mammals nurture their young, care
for other's young, will kill under various circumstances, have wide variance
in personality and behavior, etc.. I believe it was Jane Goodall that
observed a young chimp making friends with a monkey (different species).
Another chimp in the troop with a rather unpleasant personality then killed
the "friend" and ate it. We humans do not have a monopoly on either our
best or our worse personality traits.

What greatly disturbs me is that we are wiping out habitat at the rate the
land mass of a small city every single day. We push wildlife out of their
homes and then complain when they seek refuge in "our" territory. I may
bitch when the kingfisher swoops down and eats my favorite comet but I
appreciate its right to do so. That doesn't mean that I don't build my pond
in a manner (steep sides and deep) to keep the raccoons from tearing it
apart or that I don't wave the heron perching in the tree away after
enjoying its beauty.
DK


"Hank Pagel" wrote in message
...
I have come to the conclusion that raccoons are picking up bad habits
from humans.
This is the third time this year that I have found a
disemboweled bull frog on my deck when I came out in the morning. I
would not mind as much if they were eaten, that's nature. But to kill
for the hell of it, that's human nature.
Plants are trashed, rocks moved but no fish harmed. They are
not even frightened.(still hand feeding)
Well! The trap is set again. This will be #4 this year. I
think I will just leave it set all year.

Hank Pagel wrote:

I have come to the conclusion that raccoons are picking up bad habits
from humans.
This is the third time this year that I have found a
disemboweled bull frog on my deck when I came out in the morning. I
would not mind as much if they were eaten, that's nature. But to kill
for the hell of it, that's human nature.
Plants are trashed, rocks moved but no fish harmed. They are
not even frightened.(still hand feeding)

The bullfrog definitely sounds like a cat to me. My Maine Coon female
(Chelsea) when I took her outside on a leash (long story) would jump in
my first pond after frogs. She also liked to decimate plants. My Maine
Coon male (Wallenda) often brought me frogs as "midnight snacks". I
would go downstairs to let him in in the middle of the night because his
bellowing at the backdoor would wake me up and he'ld run in, jump onto
the island in the kitchen and present me with his "fresh catch of the
day". *laugh* Funny thing, he would never hurt them so I would just
put on a robe and take them back out to the pond. Lizards on the other
hand, were a totally different story.

The breeder who I got Chelsea from got into Maine Coons because he also
breeds rare geese. He was having problems with snakes eating the eggs
so someone recommended getting some Maine Coons to him as they have a
reputation for liking water and going after snakes. He got some, egg
hatching rate way up, he found he loved the Coons so got into breeding
them also as a sideline.

Susan - who can't imagine life without Maine Coons
shsimko at duke dot edu

Hank Pagel wrote:

I have come to the conclusion that raccoons are picking up bad habits
from humans.
This is the third time this year that I have found a
disemboweled bull frog on my deck when I came out in the morning. I
would not mind as much if they were eaten, that's nature. But to kill
for the hell of it, that's human nature.
Plants are trashed, rocks moved but no fish harmed. They are
not even frightened.(still hand feeding)

The bullfrog definitely sounds like a cat to me. My Maine Coon female
(Chelsea) when I took her outside on a leash (long story) would jump in
my first pond after frogs. She also liked to decimate plants. My Maine
Coon male (Wallenda) often brought me frogs as "midnight snacks". I
would go downstairs to let him in in the middle of the night because his
bellowing at the backdoor would wake me up and he'ld run in, jump onto
the island in the kitchen and present me with his "fresh catch of the
day". *laugh* Funny thing, he would never hurt them so I would just
put on a robe and take them back out to the pond. Lizards on the other
hand, were a totally different story.

The breeder who I got Chelsea from got into Maine Coons because he also
breeds rare geese. He was having problems with snakes eating the eggs
so someone recommended getting some Maine Coons to him as they have a
reputation for liking water and going after snakes. He got some, egg
hatching rate way up, he found he loved the Coons so got into breeding
them also as a sideline.

Susan - who can't imagine life without Maine Coons
shsimko at duke dot edu

On Mon, 21 Jul 2003 10:45:09 -0400, "Susan H. Simko"
wrote:

Hank Pagel wrote:

I have come to the conclusion that raccoons are picking up bad habits
from humans.
This is the third time this year that I have found a
disemboweled bull frog on my deck when I came out in the morning. I
would not mind as much if they were eaten, that's nature. But to kill
for the hell of it, that's human nature.
Plants are trashed, rocks moved but no fish harmed. They are
not even frightened.(still hand feeding)

The bullfrog definitely sounds like a cat to me. My Maine Coon female
(Chelsea) when I took her outside on a leash (long story) would jump in
my first pond after frogs. She also liked to decimate plants. My Maine
Coon male (Wallenda) often brought me frogs as "midnight snacks". I
would go downstairs to let him in in the middle of the night because his
bellowing at the backdoor would wake me up and he'ld run in, jump onto
the island in the kitchen and present me with his "fresh catch of the
day". *laugh* Funny thing, he would never hurt them so I would just
put on a robe and take them back out to the pond. Lizards on the other
hand, were a totally different story.

The breeder who I got Chelsea from got into Maine Coons because he also
breeds rare geese. He was having problems with snakes eating the eggs
so someone recommended getting some Maine Coons to him as they have a
reputation for liking water and going after snakes. He got some, egg
hatching rate way up, he found he loved the Coons so got into breeding
them also as a sideline.

Susan - who can't imagine life without Maine Coons
shsimko at duke dot edu

My Maine Coon also brings me critters unhurt except she can't quite
keep her teeth out of a yummy rat. She gets very upset if i don't
happen to want a half dead rat. Last week she did her GODAWEFUL, i
brought a critter bellow, and when i didnt want the mangled rat, she
did something i have never seen her do. She started with the tail, and
ATE everything up to the two little front legs and the head. It was
like Godfather Kitty or something. The head was in the middle of the
welcome mat. She thinks it's great fun to bring baby birds inside and
let them go for her future hunting pleasure, i GUESS! My favorite, is
when she somehow gets a little garden snake, brings it to the front
door and holds it with her paw then she wails that special known wail.
There is rarely any harm done to the snake by the cat and i let it go
after i finish playing with it.

Every once in a while, she will find a crispy gecko and bring it up on
the porch to consume the snack. I have learned not to go peeking when
i hear "crunch, crunch, crunch"....

Great cats, they are. We talk back and forth in kitty talk, i just
don't know what we say.

On Mon, 21 Jul 2003 10:45:09 -0400, "Susan H. Simko"
wrote:

Hank Pagel wrote:

I have come to the conclusion that raccoons are picking up bad habits
from humans.
This is the third time this year that I have found a
disemboweled bull frog on my deck when I came out in the morning. I
would not mind as much if they were eaten, that's nature. But to kill
for the hell of it, that's human nature.
Plants are trashed, rocks moved but no fish harmed. They are
not even frightened.(still hand feeding)

The bullfrog definitely sounds like a cat to me. My Maine Coon female
(Chelsea) when I took her outside on a leash (long story) would jump in
my first pond after frogs. She also liked to decimate plants. My Maine
Coon male (Wallenda) often brought me frogs as "midnight snacks". I
would go downstairs to let him in in the middle of the night because his
bellowing at the backdoor would wake me up and he'ld run in, jump onto
the island in the kitchen and present me with his "fresh catch of the
day". *laugh* Funny thing, he would never hurt them so I would just
put on a robe and take them back out to the pond. Lizards on the other
hand, were a totally different story.

The breeder who I got Chelsea from got into Maine Coons because he also
breeds rare geese. He was having problems with snakes eating the eggs
so someone recommended getting some Maine Coons to him as they have a
reputation for liking water and going after snakes. He got some, egg
hatching rate way up, he found he loved the Coons so got into breeding
them also as a sideline.

Susan - who can't imagine life without Maine Coons
shsimko at duke dot edu

My Maine Coon also brings me critters unhurt except she can't quite
keep her teeth out of a yummy rat. She gets very upset if i don't
happen to want a half dead rat. Last week she did her GODAWEFUL, i
brought a critter bellow, and when i didnt want the mangled rat, she
did something i have never seen her do. She started with the tail, and
ATE everything up to the two little front legs and the head. It was
like Godfather Kitty or something. The head was in the middle of the
welcome mat. She thinks it's great fun to bring baby birds inside and
let them go for her future hunting pleasure, i GUESS! My favorite, is
when she somehow gets a little garden snake, brings it to the front
door and holds it with her paw then she wails that special known wail.
There is rarely any harm done to the snake by the cat and i let it go
after i finish playing with it.

Every once in a while, she will find a crispy gecko and bring it up on
the porch to consume the snack. I have learned not to go peeking when
i hear "crunch, crunch, crunch"....

Great cats, they are. We talk back and forth in kitty talk, i just
don't know what we say.

jammer wrote:

My Maine Coon also brings me critters unhurt except she can't quite
keep her teeth out of a yummy rat. She gets very upset if i don't
happen to want a half dead rat. Last week she did her GODAWEFUL, i
brought a critter bellow, and when i didnt want the mangled rat, she
did something i have never seen her do. She started with the tail, and
ATE everything up to the two little front legs and the head. It was
like Godfather Kitty or something. The head was in the middle of the
welcome mat. She thinks it's great fun to bring baby birds inside and
let them go for her future hunting pleasure, i GUESS! My favorite, is
when she somehow gets a little garden snake, brings it to the front
door and holds it with her paw then she wails that special known wail.
There is rarely any harm done to the snake by the cat and i let it go
after i finish playing with it.

The Maine Coon "I have a present" scream is hard to miss or ignore.
Until some friends heard it no one ever believed me that it would wake
me up no matter when or where. There's also no ignoring it because they
don't stop.

My male, Wallenda, was the hunter. Frogs and lizards were his specialty
along with any snake he could find. One particular time he brought me a
lizard and I played with it for a while and let it go. Thirty minutes
later, here he is, back with the same lizard, this time with a tooth
mark in it. Played with it again and let it loose. Hour later, he
returns, this time with the head chewed off. (First and only time he
ever killed something.) I guess he was trying to make sure the
"present" didn't get away from the inept hunter once again.

Wallenda has now crossed the bridge and all my current cats are strictly
indoor only.

Great cats, they are. We talk back and forth in kitty talk, i just
don't know what we say.

I talked to Wallenda and still talk to Chelsea. I lover their vocal
range and the fact that they really rarely ever come out with a classic
meow. Lots of other noises but rarely a meow. Another hallmark of
Maine Coons.

Susan
shsimko at duke dot edu

On Mon, 21 Jul 2003 10:45:09 -0400, "Susan H. Simko"
wrote:

Hank Pagel wrote:

I have come to the conclusion that raccoons are picking up bad habits
from humans.
This is the third time this year that I have found a
disemboweled bull frog on my deck when I came out in the morning. I
would not mind as much if they were eaten, that's nature. But to kill
for the hell of it, that's human nature.
Plants are trashed, rocks moved but no fish harmed. They are
not even frightened.(still hand feeding)

The bullfrog definitely sounds like a cat to me. My Maine Coon female
(Chelsea) when I took her outside on a leash (long story) would jump in
my first pond after frogs. She also liked to decimate plants. My Maine
Coon male (Wallenda) often brought me frogs as "midnight snacks". I
would go downstairs to let him in in the middle of the night because his
bellowing at the backdoor would wake me up and he'ld run in, jump onto
the island in the kitchen and present me with his "fresh catch of the
day". *laugh* Funny thing, he would never hurt them so I would just
put on a robe and take them back out to the pond. Lizards on the other
hand, were a totally different story.

The breeder who I got Chelsea from got into Maine Coons because he also
breeds rare geese. He was having problems with snakes eating the eggs
so someone recommended getting some Maine Coons to him as they have a
reputation for liking water and going after snakes. He got some, egg
hatching rate way up, he found he loved the Coons so got into breeding
them also as a sideline.

Susan - who can't imagine life without Maine Coons
shsimko at duke dot edu

My Maine Coon also brings me critters unhurt except she can't quite
keep her teeth out of a yummy rat. She gets very upset if i don't
happen to want a half dead rat. Last week she did her GODAWEFUL, i
brought a critter bellow, and when i didnt want the mangled rat, she
did something i have never seen her do. She started with the tail, and
ATE everything up to the two little front legs and the head. It was
like Godfather Kitty or something. The head was in the middle of the
welcome mat. She thinks it's great fun to bring baby birds inside and
let them go for her future hunting pleasure, i GUESS! My favorite, is
when she somehow gets a little garden snake, brings it to the front
door and holds it with her paw then she wails that special known wail.
There is rarely any harm done to the snake by the cat and i let it go
after i finish playing with it.

Every once in a while, she will find a crispy gecko and bring it up on
the porch to consume the snack. I have learned not to go peeking when
i hear "crunch, crunch, crunch"....

Great cats, they are. We talk back and forth in kitty talk, i just
don't know what we say.

jammer wrote:

My Maine Coon also brings me critters unhurt except she can't quite
keep her teeth out of a yummy rat. She gets very upset if i don't
happen to want a half dead rat. Last week she did her GODAWEFUL, i
brought a critter bellow, and when i didnt want the mangled rat, she
did something i have never seen her do. She started with the tail, and
ATE everything up to the two little front legs and the head. It was
like Godfather Kitty or something. The head was in the middle of the
welcome mat. She thinks it's great fun to bring baby birds inside and
let them go for her future hunting pleasure, i GUESS! My favorite, is
when she somehow gets a little garden snake, brings it to the front
door and holds it with her paw then she wails that special known wail.
There is rarely any harm done to the snake by the cat and i let it go
after i finish playing with it.

The Maine Coon "I have a present" scream is hard to miss or ignore.
Until some friends heard it no one ever believed me that it would wake
me up no matter when or where. There's also no ignoring it because they
don't stop.

My male, Wallenda, was the hunter. Frogs and lizards were his specialty
along with any snake he could find. One particular time he brought me a
lizard and I played with it for a while and let it go. Thirty minutes
later, here he is, back with the same lizard, this time with a tooth
mark in it. Played with it again and let it loose. Hour later, he
returns, this time with the head chewed off. (First and only time he
ever killed something.) I guess he was trying to make sure the
"present" didn't get away from the inept hunter once again.

Wallenda has now crossed the bridge and all my current cats are strictly
indoor only.

Great cats, they are. We talk back and forth in kitty talk, i just
don't know what we say.

I talked to Wallenda and still talk to Chelsea. I lover their vocal
range and the fact that they really rarely ever come out with a classic
meow. Lots of other noises but rarely a meow. Another hallmark of
Maine Coons.

Susan
shsimko at duke dot edu