Andy writes:

All of the storage instructions I have seen for small engines, such
as
lawnmowers, say to take out the spark plug and put in a couple
teaspoons
of oil, and pull it thru a couple times, then replace the spark plug.
I have done that for several decades without a problem. But
something
occurred to me.

Why can't we just tilt the mower so that the spark plug is pointed
DOWN
(easy for vertical shaft engines) and then just pull it thru a couple
times.??

It seems to me that the oil will run over the bottom of the piston
and
when the unit is pulled thru a couple times, the oil will wipe the
inside
of the cylinder, accomplishing the same thing as when we squirted
oil into the top of the cylinder....

I would like to hear any opinions on this. Perhaps there is
something I
missed, but this would save a little trouble , and could easily be done
after each mowing operation.....

Andy in Eureka, Texas

"AndyS" wrote in message
ups.com...
Andy writes:

All of the storage instructions I have seen for small engines, such
as
lawnmowers, say to take out the spark plug and put in a couple
teaspoons
of oil, and pull it thru a couple times, then replace the spark plug.
I have done that for several decades without a problem. But
something
occurred to me.

Why can't we just tilt the mower so that the spark plug is pointed
DOWN
(easy for vertical shaft engines) and then just pull it thru a couple
times.??

It seems to me that the oil will run over the bottom of the piston
and
when the unit is pulled thru a couple times, the oil will wipe the
inside
of the cylinder, accomplishing the same thing as when we squirted
oil into the top of the cylinder....

I would like to hear any opinions on this. Perhaps there is
something I
missed, but this would save a little trouble , and could easily be done
after each mowing operation.....

Andy in Eureka, Texas


Sounds like a helluva good idea. Strange I've never heard it before. But
then I never bother to put oil in the spark plug hole either - and I'm
runnin a bunch of old equipment.

Srgnt Billko wrote:
"AndyS" wrote in message
ups.com...
Andy writes:

All of the storage instructions I have seen for small engines, such
as
lawnmowers, say to take out the spark plug and put in a couple
teaspoons
of oil, and pull it thru a couple times, then replace the spark plug.
I have done that for several decades without a problem. But
something
occurred to me.

Why can't we just tilt the mower so that the spark plug is pointed
DOWN
(easy for vertical shaft engines) and then just pull it thru a couple
times.??

It seems to me that the oil will run over the bottom of the piston
and
when the unit is pulled thru a couple times, the oil will wipe the
inside
of the cylinder, accomplishing the same thing as when we squirted
oil into the top of the cylinder....

I would like to hear any opinions on this. Perhaps there is
something I
missed, but this would save a little trouble , and could easily be done
after each mowing operation.....

Andy in Eureka, Texas


Sounds like a helluva good idea. Strange I've never heard it before. But
then I never bother to put oil in the spark plug hole either - and I'm
runnin a bunch of old equipment.

Hi...

I suspect that over a short period of time virtually no oil
would get past the rings, so there'd be no effect at all.

On the other hand, over a long period of time sufficient oil
might get past the ring splits, but wouldn't serve any purpose
other than drowning the plug.

Take care.

Ken

AndyS wrote:
Why can't we just tilt the mower so that the spark plug is pointed
DOWN
(easy for vertical shaft engines) and then just pull it thru a couple
times.??

It seems to me that the oil will run over the bottom of the piston
and
when the unit is pulled thru a couple times, the oil will wipe the
inside
of the cylinder, accomplishing the same thing as when we squirted
oil into the top of the cylinder....


Because the oil will flow much more freely into the intake/air
filter/carb through the crankcase breather than it will past the rings.

--
Art

"Art" wrote in message
news:HxXTg.16292$2g4.13992@dukeread09...
AndyS wrote:
Why can't we just tilt the mower so that the spark plug is pointed
DOWN
(easy for vertical shaft engines) and then just pull it thru a couple
times.??

It seems to me that the oil will run over the bottom of the piston
and
when the unit is pulled thru a couple times, the oil will wipe the
inside
of the cylinder, accomplishing the same thing as when we squirted
oil into the top of the cylinder....


Because the oil will flow much more freely into the intake/air
filter/carb through the crankcase breather than it will past the rings.

--
Art

Huh ?

"Srgnt Billko" wrote:
"AndyS" wrote in message
ups.com...
Andy writes:

All of the storage instructions I have seen for small engines, such
as
lawnmowers, say to take out the spark plug and put in a couple
teaspoons
of oil, and pull it thru a couple times, then replace the spark plug.
I have done that for several decades without a problem. But
something
occurred to me.

Why can't we just tilt the mower so that the spark plug is pointed
DOWN
(easy for vertical shaft engines) and then just pull it thru a couple
times.??

It seems to me that the oil will run over the bottom of the piston
and
when the unit is pulled thru a couple times, the oil will wipe the
inside
of the cylinder, accomplishing the same thing as when we squirted
oil into the top of the cylinder....

I would like to hear any opinions on this. Perhaps there is
something I
missed, but this would save a little trouble , and could easily be done
after each mowing operation.....

Andy in Eureka, Texas


Sounds like a helluva good idea. Strange I've never heard it before.
But then I never bother to put oil in the spark plug hole either - and
I'm runnin a bunch of old equipment.

I fog boat engines and oil the plugs, so it does make sense. I've never
done it to lawn equipment though. Perhaps I should.

"AndyS" wrote in message
ups.com...
Andy writes:

All of the storage instructions I have seen for small engines, such
as
lawnmowers, say to take out the spark plug and put in a couple
teaspoons
of oil, and pull it thru a couple times, then replace the spark plug.
I have done that for several decades without a problem. But
something
occurred to me.

Why can't we just tilt the mower so that the spark plug is pointed
DOWN
(easy for vertical shaft engines) and then just pull it thru a couple
times.??

It seems to me that the oil will run over the bottom of the piston
and
when the unit is pulled thru a couple times, the oil will wipe the
inside
of the cylinder, accomplishing the same thing as when we squirted
oil into the top of the cylinder....

I would like to hear any opinions on this. Perhaps there is
something I
missed, but this would save a little trouble , and could easily be done
after each mowing operation.....

Andy in Eureka, Texas

If the engine in the mower is in any kind of (good ) shape, no oil will flow
past the piston rings.
And only a small mower could be tilted as you suggest by a man of average
strength.
Removing the spark plug and introducing a small quantity of oil is a mundane
task.
But none of this is required after each mowing- only for storage over
winter.

Chas Hurst wrote:

If the engine in the mower is in any kind of (good ) shape, no oil will flow
past the piston rings.
And only a small mower could be tilted as you suggest by a man of average
strength.
Removing the spark plug and introducing a small quantity of oil is a mundane
task.
But none of this is required after each mowing- only for storage over
winter.

Andy writes:
My thanks to all those who ventured a reply here.

I'd like to comment on Chas's reply, which is typical of those who
had reservations on this method.

When you put oil in the spark plug hole, only two things get
lubricated - 1) Part of the top of the piston and 2) The part of the
cylinder where the rings actually wipe. The rest of the inside of the
top of the cylinder stays as it was, since there is nothing to wipe the
oil over it AND the quantity of oil isn't large enough to slosh ( for
good
reason)..
Wiping the rings coats that part of the cylinder since THAT PART is
the part that has wear 6 months later when you crank it up for the
spring. Having a little film of oil on that small part of the cylinder
wall
helps reduce the excessive wear that dry piston rings have on a dry
cylinder wall. Remember how the engine lays and where the oil
reservoir lies..... Most of the cylinder does not normally anywhere
near the oil, and that's OK, since there is no rubbing action on that
part of the cylinder....

Also, oiling thru a spark plug hole works much better on an
engine whose cylinder is vertical, since the oil will distribute itself
all over the top of the piston before wiping. On a vertical shaft
engine where the piston is horizontal, only the bottom of the cylinder
will be wiped UNLESS you tilt the mower to make the spark plug on
top...... Same tilting action as I proposed for the internal wipe,
except
upside down....... Yall gotta think about what happens inside the
cylinder .........

So, in my opinion, it doesn't matter whether the piston rings wipe
the ring area from the bottom or from the top.

Regarding the strength to tilt the lawnmore and pull the cord
two or three times ---- well, it just never gave me a second thought.
I would think that if such strength were lacking in the actor, that
he/she
would be paying someone to mow their yard anyway :))))

Regarding pouring oil out the crankcase breather tube ---
it doesn't happen in the 3-4 second the mower is tilted. Heck,
I tilt the mower longer than that when I'm mowing.... I've never
seen it happen..... And , for this operation, there is no internal
pressure buildup to vent, to speak of....

Ok, thanks again everyone. I welcome criticism of my understanding
of the inside of a mower. There's a lot of guys here I can learn from.

Andy in Eureka, Texas

AndyS wrote:
Chas Hurst wrote:
If the engine in the mower is in any kind of (good ) shape, no oil will flow
past the piston rings.
And only a small mower could be tilted as you suggest by a man of average
strength.
Removing the spark plug and introducing a small quantity of oil is a mundane
task.
But none of this is required after each mowing- only for storage over
winter.

Andy writes:
My thanks to all those who ventured a reply here.

I'd like to comment on Chas's reply, which is typical of those who
had reservations on this method.

When you put oil in the spark plug hole, only two things get
lubricated - 1) Part of the top of the piston and 2) The part of the
cylinder where the rings actually wipe. The rest of the inside of the
top of the cylinder stays as it was, since there is nothing to wipe the
oil over it AND the quantity of oil isn't large enough to slosh ( for
good
reason)..
Wiping the rings coats that part of the cylinder since THAT PART is
the part that has wear 6 months later when you crank it up for the
spring. Having a little film of oil on that small part of the cylinder
wall
helps reduce the excessive wear that dry piston rings have on a dry
cylinder wall. Remember how the engine lays and where the oil
reservoir lies..... Most of the cylinder does not normally anywhere
near the oil, and that's OK, since there is no rubbing action on that
part of the cylinder....

Also, oiling thru a spark plug hole works much better on an
engine whose cylinder is vertical, since the oil will distribute itself
all over the top of the piston before wiping. On a vertical shaft
engine where the piston is horizontal, only the bottom of the cylinder
will be wiped UNLESS you tilt the mower to make the spark plug on
top...... Same tilting action as I proposed for the internal wipe,
except
upside down....... Yall gotta think about what happens inside the
cylinder .........

So, in my opinion, it doesn't matter whether the piston rings wipe
the ring area from the bottom or from the top.

Regarding the strength to tilt the lawnmore and pull the cord
two or three times ---- well, it just never gave me a second thought.
I would think that if such strength were lacking in the actor, that
he/she
would be paying someone to mow their yard anyway :))))

Regarding pouring oil out the crankcase breather tube ---
it doesn't happen in the 3-4 second the mower is tilted. Heck,
I tilt the mower longer than that when I'm mowing.... I've never
seen it happen..... And , for this operation, there is no internal
pressure buildup to vent, to speak of....

Ok, thanks again everyone. I welcome criticism of my understanding
of the inside of a mower. There's a lot of guys here I can learn from.

Hi...

On a somewhat related side issue, I do believe it's worthwhile,
when putting away a small engine, to pull gently on the starter
until you feel compression resistance, and leave it that way, with
the valves closed.

Take care.

Ken

Ken Weitzel wrote:

On a somewhat related side issue, I do believe it's worthwhile,
when putting away a small engine, to pull gently on the starter
until you feel compression resistance, and leave it that way, with
the valves closed.

Take care.

Ken

Andy comments:
Now THAT sounds like a great idea !! After pulling it thru a couple
times
leave it at top dead center.... .... I'm going to start doing
that..... thanks.

Andy in Eureka, Texas

Srgnt Billko wrote:
"Art" wrote in message
news:HxXTg.16292$2g4.13992@dukeread09...

AndyS wrote:

Why can't we just tilt the mower so that the spark plug is pointed
DOWN
(easy for vertical shaft engines) and then just pull it thru a couple
times.??

It seems to me that the oil will run over the bottom of the piston
and
when the unit is pulled thru a couple times, the oil will wipe the
inside
of the cylinder, accomplishing the same thing as when we squirted
oil into the top of the cylinder....


Because the oil will flow much more freely into the intake/air
filter/carb through the crankcase breather than it will past the rings.


Huh ?


The crankcase has to be vented so it does not build up pressure from the
small amount of blow-by that gets past the rings. This vent is part of
the valve cover on a side valve engine (most of the small engines out
there.) There is a tube or hose that connect this vent to the intake so
as to actually create a slight vacuum in the crankcase when the engine
is running. When you tip the engine the wrong way the oil flows pretty
freely through the vent and then into the intake. Once there it is a
major nuisance. It can saturate the air filter, get into the carb and
even leak past the intake valve into the cylinder. While this might be
good for storage purposes, it's going to be a mess when it's time to get
it running again.

--
Art

AndyS wrote:
When you put oil in the spark plug hole, only two things get
lubricated - 1) Part of the top of the piston and 2) The part of the
cylinder where the rings actually wipe. The rest of the inside of the
top of the cylinder stays as it was, since there is nothing to wipe the
oil over it AND the quantity of oil isn't large enough to slosh ( for
good
reason)..

Gravity takes the oil to the lowest part of the cylinder. Condensation
will also head for that same area. You want the oil to get there first
to provide a barrier.

Wiping the rings coats that part of the cylinder since THAT PART is
the part that has wear 6 months later when you crank it up for the
spring. Having a little film of oil on that small part of the cylinder
wall
helps reduce the excessive wear that dry piston rings have on a dry

Most small engines have a small plastic oil slinger in them that begin
slinging oil as soon as you attempt to start it. The storage oil is more
to protect from rust or corrosion that can cause stuck rings from
moisture than as a pre-lube to reduce wear.

cylinder wall. Remember how the engine lays and where the oil
reservoir lies..... Most of the cylinder does not normally anywhere
near the oil, and that's OK, since there is no rubbing action on that
part of the cylinder....

Also, oiling thru a spark plug hole works much better on an
engine whose cylinder is vertical, since the oil will distribute itself
all over the top of the piston before wiping. On a vertical shaft
engine where the piston is horizontal, only the bottom of the cylinder
will be wiped UNLESS you tilt the mower to make the spark plug on

In the cases of stuck rings that I have seen most were caused by carbon.
The rest were caused by rust or corrosion and always at the bottom of the
cylinder.

top...... Same tilting action as I proposed for the internal wipe,
except
upside down....... Yall gotta think about what happens inside the
cylinder .........

So, in my opinion, it doesn't matter whether the piston rings wipe
the ring area from the bottom or from the top.

Regarding the strength to tilt the lawnmore and pull the cord
two or three times ---- well, it just never gave me a second thought.
I would think that if such strength were lacking in the actor, that
he/she
would be paying someone to mow their yard anyway :))))

Agreed.

Regarding pouring oil out the crankcase breather tube ---
it doesn't happen in the 3-4 second the mower is tilted. Heck,

3-4 seconds is not going to do anything. I would guess (and it's only a
guess) it would require more like a minute or longer to allow any oil to
leak past the rings.

I tilt the mower longer than that when I'm mowing.... I've never
seen it happen..... And , for this operation, there is no internal

If you tip the mower with the crankcase breather down for long, while it
is running it will start sucking oil through the breather and smoking
heavily.

pressure buildup to vent, to speak of....

There is no internal pressure buildup ever. While it is running there is
a vacuum.


Ok, thanks again everyone. I welcome criticism of my understanding
of the inside of a mower. There's a lot of guys here I can learn from.


If you are going to do this then I suggest you locate the valve breather
and make sure it is kept as near the top as possible while tipping.
Maybe even remove the plug just to see how long it does take for some
oil to come out of the plug hole. If you do that, let us know how long
it took. I am curious.


--
Art

AndyS wrote:

Ken Weitzel wrote:

On a somewhat related side issue, I do believe it's worthwhile,
when putting away a small engine, to pull gently on the starter
until you feel compression resistance, and leave it that way, with
the valves closed.

Take care.

Ken


Andy comments:
Now THAT sounds like a great idea !! After pulling it thru a couple
times
leave it at top dead center.... .... I'm going to start doing
that..... thanks.

Andy in Eureka, Texas


That is definitely a good idea. Moisture and condensation are bad and if
you can leave the valves closed it should keep most of that out of the
cylinder.

--
Art

Art wrote:


If you are going to do this then I suggest you locate the valve breather
and make sure it is kept as near the top as possible while tipping.
Maybe even remove the plug just to see how long it does take for some
oil to come out of the plug hole. If you do that, let us know how long
it took. I am curious.


--
Art

Thanks Art,

As an aside, I stored a boat motor for a couple months with the
motor
tilted too far toward the plug, and the space in the cylinder filled up
with
oil from leakage. When I tried to crank it, the oil would not let the
piston
go all the way. It felt like the engine had seized. Really felt like
a hard
clunk metal thing..... As a last resort I pulled the plug to see if I
could
tell anything and the oil ran right out. I put the plug back , and the

problem disappeared, tho it did smoke like hell for a couple
minutes....

So now I always store the boat motor with the engine tilted so that
it can't leak past the rings into the cylinder head....

Just thought I'd mention it.... I was very pleased with myself when
the problem went away :)))))

Andy in Eureka, Texas

AndyS wrote:

[....]

Just thought I'd mention it.... I was very pleased with myself when
the problem went away :)))))

Andy in Eureka, Texas

just something about the way you said "pleased" has
prompted me to share these pictures from my web page
concerning a recently completed repair that I'm really
really really pleased with the outcome of.

http://personalpages.bellsouth.net/t...tr-repair.html