Which one is better for my flowers?

Lori

On Sat, 15 Mar 2003 22:58:13 GMT, wrote:

Which one is better for my flowers?

Lori

Both are good. Cattle is better of the two. Horse manure needs more
composting and often used to grow mushrooms.

If you can help it do not use horse manure.......it is good stuff but very
weedy.....cow is better......HW
wrote in message
...
Which one is better for my flowers?

Lori

On Sun, 16 Mar 2003 11:36:20 GMT, "Anne Middleton/Harold Walker"
wrote:

If you can help it do not use horse manure.......it is good stuff but very
weedy.....cow is better......HW

wrote
Which one is better for my flowers?

Something about a cow's stomach(s), or perhaps its culinary
preferences, makes cow manure less weedy than horse. Both benefit from
composting or aging. Choose old over fresh. And don't step...

In article ,
(Frogleg) wrote:

On Sun, 16 Mar 2003 11:36:20 GMT, "Anne Middleton/Harold Walker"
wrote:

If you can help it do not use horse manure.......it is good stuff but very
weedy.....cow is better......HW

wrote
Which one is better for my flowers?

Something about a cow's stomach(s), or perhaps its culinary
preferences, makes cow manure less weedy than horse. Both benefit from
composting or aging. Choose old over fresh. And don't step...

If it's properly composted it ain't gonna be weedy. I've even used rabbit
raisens (which is so poorly digested rabbits will eat what they crapped a
second time if they can get at it) & though fresh it would sprout weeds,
composted it does nothing of the sort.

I do realize some people do indeed spread manures streaming fresh & it's
probably not all that dangerous even allowing that there are many
potential unhealthy ramifications. I wouldn't think anyone with a
home-garden they will actually have to smell would use any of it
uncomposted though, unless they have a spike farm & need to feed the
flies.

-paghat the ratgirl

--
"Of what are you afraid, my child?" inquired the kindly teacher.
"Oh, sir! The flowers, they are wild," replied the timid creature.
-from Peter Newell's "Wild Flowers"
See the Garden of Paghat the Ratgirl: http://www.paghat.com/

Xref: news7 rec.gardens:214046



paghat wrote:

In article ,
(Frogleg) wrote:

On Sun, 16 Mar 2003 11:36:20 GMT, "Anne Middleton/Harold Walker"
wrote:

If you can help it do not use horse manure.......it is good stuff but very
weedy.....cow is better......HW

wrote
Which one is better for my flowers?

Something about a cow's stomach(s), or perhaps its culinary
preferences, makes cow manure less weedy than horse. Both benefit from
composting or aging. Choose old over fresh. And don't step...

If it's properly composted it ain't gonna be weedy. I've even used rabbit
raisens (which is so poorly digested rabbits will eat what they crapped a
second time if they can get at it) & though fresh it would sprout weeds,
composted it does nothing of the sort.

I do realize some people do indeed spread manures streaming fresh & it's
probably not all that dangerous even allowing that there are many
potential unhealthy ramifications. I wouldn't think anyone with a
home-garden they will actually have to smell would use any of it
uncomposted though, unless they have a spike farm & need to feed the
flies.

The problem with fresh manure is not so much the weeds OR health problems
(although they may be of some concern) but the high ammonia levels (read:
nitrogen) which can and will burn plants. The compost process or aging the maure
will allow a good portion of this to volatize, reducing the potential for
burning.

Both llama and rabbit manure can be used fresh without problem - very low
ammonia levels and the mainstay of their diets is alfafa, which is an excellent
source of organic nitrogen. I do compost my rabbits' manure because it is mixed
with their timothy hay bedding which IS seedy, but it composts very quickly, even
in a static pile.

pam - gardengal

Fresh or composted, it does not matter. Work it into the soil in fall. Cows best

Ian

"Ian" wrote in message
om...
Fresh or composted, it does not matter. Work it into the soil in fall.
Cows best


If you work fresh manure into the soil in the fall it gives the bacteria in
the soil time to reduce the nitrogen levels, or atleast turn the ammonia and
urea into nitrite and nitrate compounds. Using fresh manure in the spring is
generally considered a bad idea. The nitrogen level is too high and can burn
the plants.

Sameer

(Frogleg) expounded:

Something about a cow's stomach(s), or perhaps its culinary
preferences, makes cow manure less weedy than horse. Both benefit from
composting or aging. Choose old over fresh. And don't step...

Cows ruminate, meaning they grind up their food, that's what they're
doing when they're 'chewing their cud'.

Rabbit can be used right from the bunny, as can sheep doo and (from
what Pam says) llama.

Chicken should be well composted, as it is very high in nitrogen and
will burn if used fresh.

Horse is fine provided you don't mind pulling many, many weeds if it
isn't well composted (high heat to kill the weed seeds).

--
Ann, Gardening in zone 6a
Just south of Boston, MA
********************************

Yes fall incorperation of manure is best. I'd say composted manure is
easier to handle also. I would not be concerned too much about the
incorperation of fresh cattle manure in the spring because it
generally does not have too high of ammonia levels, but pig and
chicken manure could cause you trouble.

Ian

In article , wrote:

On Sat, 15 Mar 2003 22:58:13 GMT, wrote:

Which one is better for my flowers?

Lori

Both are good. Cattle is better of the two. Horse manure needs more
composting and often used to grow mushrooms.

But some of the mushrooms it grows naturally are quite edible and
yummy. IIRC, "horse mushrooms" are agaricus sp. (The little white
button mushrooms you buy in the grocery store are also an agaricus
variety.)

Horse apples are a little higher in N. Both are good, but, as a rancher,
I *really* recommend hot composting, to kill weed seeds. Our cow
manure grows hemp nettle and chickweed, neither of which you want
in your garden.

Jan

Ann wrote in message . ..
(Frogleg) expounded:

Something about a cow's stomach(s), or perhaps its culinary
preferences, makes cow manure less weedy than horse. Both benefit from
composting or aging. Choose old over fresh. And don't step...

Cows ruminate, meaning they grind up their food, that's what they're
doing when they're 'chewing their cud'.

Rabbit can be used right from the bunny, as can sheep doo and (from
what Pam says) llama.

Chicken should be well composted, as it is very high in nitrogen and
will burn if used fresh.

Horse is fine provided you don't mind pulling many, many weeds if it
isn't well composted (high heat to kill the weed seeds).

You know, this is not my experience. Yes, there may be the occasional
oat or wheat plant coming out of horse manure, some clover, and a
prostrate cloverlike plant with yellow flowers whose name escapes me,
but not much more than that.

paghat wrote:
: In article ,
: (Frogleg) wrote:

: On Sun, 16 Mar 2003 11:36:20 GMT, "Anne Middleton/Harold Walker"
: wrote:
:
: If you can help it do not use horse manure.......it is good stuff but very
: weedy.....cow is better......HW
:
: wrote
: Which one is better for my flowers?
:
: Something about a cow's stomach(s), or perhaps its culinary
: preferences, makes cow manure less weedy than horse. Both benefit from
: composting or aging. Choose old over fresh. And don't step...

: If it's properly composted it ain't gonna be weedy. I've even used rabbit
: raisens (which is so poorly digested rabbits will eat what they crapped a
: second time if they can get at it) & though fresh it would sprout weeds,
: composted it does nothing of the sort.

Properly hot composting cow or horse manure (and bedding) is a serious
undertaking and hard to do on a small scale. You have to know what you're
doing, and you have to have the right equipment. If you're stuff's good,
it's taken work to produce and you're for sure not going to be giving it
away.

Most 'composted' manure that will be readily (and freely) available in
quantity to the home gardener looking for local sources will almost
certainly not be hot composted. I would call it 'old manure' instead of
compost ;-) Cold composting takes much longer and will eventually produce
a good, loose soil additive. But I would never use it as mulch and
certainly wouldn't expect much in terms of fertilizer value.

Many, many factors will affect the nutritive value. How fresh is the
manure is when it's collected? Nitrogen is lost very rapidly. Its
moisture content will have a major impact on its ability to reach the
temperatures needed to kill pathogens and weed seeds. Weed seed content
will vary widely depending on pasture maintenance (are weeds allowed to go
to seed?) and hay quality.

I've been working on hot-composting our four-horse output for the last
three years and still can't say I've gotten it right ;-) Last year's
batch cooked for over a year and came out very pretty, fine-textured and
dark. Only this year's spring rains will reveal its weed seed content.
But I am counting more on the fact that we feed good, clean hay and are
fanatical about pasture maintenance than on the success of my amateur
efforts at hot-composting horse manure ;-)

-- Karen

The Garden Gate http://garden-gate.prairienet.org
================================================== =================
"If you have a garden and a library, you have everything you need."
^and cats -- Cicero
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(simy1) expounded:

You know, this is not my experience. Yes, there may be the occasional
oat or wheat plant coming out of horse manure, some clover, and a
prostrate cloverlike plant with yellow flowers whose name escapes me,
but not much more than that.

I suppose it depends on what the horse eats. I used it a couple times
(horse) and got the same weed all over the place in my perennial
borders. In the veggie garden I don't care much, but I do when it
comes to my borders. I'll stick to cow, I've used it for 25 years
around here and have had nothing but good luck with it.

--
Ann, Gardening in zone 6a
Just south of Boston, MA
********************************

"Ann" wrote in message
...
(simy1) expounded:

I suppose it depends on what the horse eats. I used it a couple times
(horse) and got the same weed all over the place in my perennial
borders. In the veggie garden I don't care much, but I do when it
comes to my borders. I'll stick to cow, I've used it for 25 years
around here and have had nothing but good luck with it.

--
Ann, Gardening in zone 6a
Just south of Boston, MA
********************************
At one time my parents used fresh horse manure as a heat source in a hot bed
to start seedlings in the spring. A foot and a half deep rectangular hole
was dug in the ground in the fall, and it was covered with a south facing
wooden structure with an old window on hinges used as a cover. In the spring
(middle of March-zone 3) a foot of manure was placed in the bottom of the
hole followed by a six inch layer of straw. The seeds were planted in trays
and placed on top of the straw. Enough heat was generated by the decomposing
manure to keep the structure frost free. On extremely cold nights a horse
blanket was put on top of the structure. It was the poor man's way of making
a green house.

P.S. Well rotted cow manure works great, but I prefer sheep or rabbit
manure.

John