Last summer I built an addition on the north side of my fathers house
to serve as a cold storage basement for vegies. The space size is eight
feet wide by ten feet long by ten feet high. The space is not heated and
has a normal temp between 35 to 40 deg. fh so far this winter, a great
place for my potted trees as it turns out. It has been rather cold over the
past two weeks, (about 10 to 15 daytime and -10 to -20 at night outside) so
the inside temps have been slightly below freezing, between 28 and 30 fh.
While checking on them today I noticed many of them needed watering. After
watering I noticed that on a few of them the water was not soaking in after
a few minutes. After checking a little closer I found that they were
frozen. I decided to warm the space up to about 55 for about two hours to
try and thaw the frozen trees but I still had standing water on a few. The
trees are not potbound just frozen. should I bring the trees in to room
temp and thaw them to allow the watere to settle in or leave them alone?

Mike Waterhouse
Litchfield, Maine
Zone 4b
"Still plowing snow"

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Many of my bonsai are frozen solid too. Some of the pots look like ice
cubes. Don't worry about them. If they are in a dark area with out wind
(very little air circulation) they should be fine. I watered all my
bonsai a few weeks ago when the temperatures were in the 60'sF. Last
night we had 10 below Zero. So far over 68 inches of snow (and behind
last year's snowfall). My bonsai are in poly houses and in a garage
where the temperatures are approximately 27F. Three of the poly houses
are not heated and the temperature goes well below that.

If your bonsai are healthy and winter hardy they should leaf out in
spring. If not they may be permanently dormant...

Bill

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BY all means leave them. I am also in Zone 4 and my hardy trees are frozen
for the winter. They are protected on all sides and top from the wind and
snow load and
critters. Otherwise they will be fine until spring. My set up lets melted
snow and rain
into the area with good drainage in case of warm up. You do not want to
warm them
up...you could start a bud out!!
Keep growing
Pauline F Muth Zone 4 West Charlton NY USA
www.pfmbonsai.com





-----Original Message-----
From: Internet Bonsai Club ]On Behalf
Of Mike Waterhouse
Sent: Thursday, January 27, 2005 7:39 PM
To:
Subject: [IBC] Frozen pots and watering.


Last summer I built an addition on the north side of my fathers house
to serve as a cold storage basement for vegies. The space size is eight
feet wide by ten feet long by ten feet high. The space is not heated and
has a normal temp between 35 to 40 deg. fh so far this winter, a great
place for my potted trees as it turns out. It has been rather cold over the
past two weeks, (about 10 to 15 daytime and -10 to -20 at night outside) so
the inside temps have been slightly below freezing, between 28 and 30 fh.
While checking on them today I noticed many of them needed watering. After
watering I noticed that on a few of them the water was not soaking in after
a few minutes. After checking a little closer I found that they were
frozen. I decided to warm the space up to about 55 for about two hours to
try and thaw the frozen trees but I still had standing water on a few. The
trees are not potbound just frozen. should I bring the trees in to room
temp and thaw them to allow the watere to settle in or leave them alone?

Mike Waterhouse
Litchfield, Maine
Zone 4b
"Still plowing snow"

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****
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****
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+++++ Questions? Help? e-mail +++++

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Thanks Pauline. I had been going with the same setup as you for the past
fifteen years and it worked fine until last year when I was attacked by rodents
that wiped out all my tridents and hornbeams and many of my Japanese Maples.
Thanks.

Mike Waterhouse
Litchfield, Maine
Zone 4b

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I really know the feeling...the critters are my real problem not the
temperatures. -22 here this am without wind-chill
Critters certainly love all maples and hornbeams
.....I put moth balls in the storage area before
I seal it in. Some years I even used the electronic buzzers type.
Sealing them in a box of hardware cloth ( coarse screen) inside the storage
really works
but is a pain to set up.
Interesting that you can put tridents in storage. It is too cold for them
here.
I greenhouse them here around Thanksgiving and keep them there until
May...I defoliate before taking them outside in the spring.
Good luck and keep growing
Pauline F Muth Zone 4 West Charlton NY USA
www.pfmbonsai.com




-----Original Message-----
From: Internet Bonsai Club ]On Behalf
Of Mike Waterhouse
Sent: Thursday, January 27, 2005 8:12 PM
To:
Subject: [IBC] Frozen pots and watering.


Thanks Pauline. I had been going with the same setup as you for the past
fifteen years and it worked fine until last year when I was attacked by
rodents
that wiped out all my tridents and hornbeams and many of my Japanese
Maples.
Thanks.

Mike Waterhouse
Litchfield, Maine
Zone 4b

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I don't have a greenhouse YET but I hope to have one in the near future. I
have had problems with winter die back on my Tridents in the past and I did
blame it on the cold weather here in Maine. Any thoughts on how to over winter
them here in Maine? How cold can I allow Tridents to go?

Mike Waterhouse
Litchfield, Maine
Zone 4b

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Some of my students in Zone 5 get them through the winter in coolers in
their unheated garages.
That can work for Zone 4 most years. It did for me in my early days of
bonsai but I never tried it in
the coldest of years...those that stay below -20 for a week or two or more.
Do you have an unheated basement?
Pauline F Muth Zone 4 West Charlton NY USA
www.pfmbonsai.com




-----Original Message-----
From: Internet Bonsai Club ]On Behalf
Of Mike Waterhouse
Sent: Thursday, January 27, 2005 8:44 PM
To:
Subject: [IBC] Frozen pots and watering.


I don't have a greenhouse YET but I hope to have one in the near future. I
have had problems with winter die back on my Tridents in the past and I did
blame it on the cold weather here in Maine. Any thoughts on how to over
winter
them here in Maine? How cold can I allow Tridents to go?

Mike Waterhouse
Litchfield, Maine
Zone 4b

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The space I have available to me now sounds like it should work fine now,
the addition I built on to my fathers basement. It is unheated. The temps range
from 28 to 40 degrees fer. . for the most part above freezing. Should be fine
for Tridents. I hope to acquire a few this spring.

Mike Waterhouse
Litchfield, Maine
Zone 4b

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On Jan 27, 2005, at 8:43 PM, Mike Waterhouse wrote:

I don't have a greenhouse YET but I hope to have one in the near
future. I
have had problems with winter die back on my Tridents in the past and
I did
blame it on the cold weather here in Maine. Any thoughts on how to
over winter
them here in Maine? How cold can I allow Tridents to go?

Mike Waterhouse
Litchfield, Maine
Zone 4b


Mike:
Anita and I received a trident as a wedding present. Right now (with
-18) I have it in the basement in a cold spot. I don't know the
temperature but I can see my breath. The tree is in a styrofoam
cooler, mulched with leaves, and filled the rest of the way with
styrofoam peanuts. I water it every few days. It will go back outside
once it warms up some. I have generally been told that tridents are
really zone 6, and we're on the edge of that here. Some on the list
have told me in particular that they don't respond well to cold wind.

Sounds like a typical Maine winter. This is as cold as it gets here.
Should set a new record.

Craig Cowing
NY
Zone 5b/6a Sunset 37

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Never water a tree when the temp autside is near freezing ( but you
did not realize )..
if your trees are taken by ice do not thaw them it only kills them !

leave them until untaw by tehmselves , and never take them inside the
house with warmer temperatures

Mike Waterhouse wrote:

Thanks Pauline. I had been going with the same setup as you for the past
fifteen years and it worked fine until last year when I was attacked by rodents
that wiped out all my tridents and hornbeams and many of my Japanese Maples.
Thanks.

Mike Waterhouse
Litchfield, Maine
Zone 4b

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************************************************** ******************************

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Mike Waterhouse wrote:

I don't have a greenhouse YET but I hope to have one in the near future. I
have had problems with winter die back on my Tridents in the past and I did
blame it on the cold weather here in Maine. Any thoughts on how to over winter
them here in Maine? How cold can I allow Tridents to go?
next time you could take a wooden box or a styrprene box make some
holes on teh bottom for water leaking , and fill it in with dead
leaves and than bury the bonsai pot inside will keep them
protected during the winther , you can use sow dust or peat or
whatever material to protect your pots and trees

Mike Waterhouse
Litchfield, Maine
Zone 4b

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I did a talk for our local club on bonsai Winter care, in between nervous, sputtering and stammering, to make to point of not watering while root ball is frozen. I asked them to visualize a glass full of ice cubes then visualize pouring water or other adult beverage in it. What do you hear? Crack, Crack, Pop, Crack, pop,maybe, phisss, then I asked them, do you think it is a good idea to water your trees when frozen?

Thought I would pass along, I don't come up with clever tidbits often.

Doug T.

WMass Zone 5



----- Original Message -----

From:
To:
Sent: Saturday, January 29, 2005 2:32 AM
Subject: [IBC] Frozen pots and watering.


Never water a tree when the temp autside is near freezing ( but you
did not realize )..
if your trees are taken by ice do not thaw them it only kills them !

leave them until untaw by tehmselves , and never take them inside the
house with warmer temperatures

Mike Waterhouse wrote:

Thanks Pauline. I had been going with the same setup as you for the past
fifteen years and it worked fine until last year when I was attacked by rodents
that wiped out all my tridents and hornbeams and many of my Japanese Maples.
Thanks.

Mike Waterhouse
Litchfield, Maine
Zone 4b

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Douglas Taylor wrote:

I did a talk for our local club on bonsai Winter care,

in between nervous, sputtering and stammering,

to make to point of not watering while root ball is frozen.

I asked them to visualize a glass full of ice cubes

then visualize pouring water or other adult beverage in it.

What do you hear? Crack, Crack, Pop, Crack, pop,maybe,

phisss, then I asked them, do you think it is a good

idea to water your trees when frozen?

Thought I would pass along, I don't come up with clever tidbits often.

when the soil is iced tha plant does not absorb water from roots as
water is solid... so I do not see the necessity of watering ..

if you take them inside the branches will wither as continue
evaporation from the thin bark or buds and the roots do not pump
this is why you just have to sit and prey that all will be ok ...
and water them as soon as teh soil will be not iced anymore and if is
not forecasted an ice wave again ...
Mine on a balcony are taken inside for 20 minutes and vaporized with
water on the buds, if necessary , and as soon as they are dry I put them
back outside

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Private Mail :
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