The powers that be, who put the infrastructure in place, sold our water
utilities, stopped making dams, made water scarce and imported many more
people than we could sustain, created this problem. They even stopped
farmers from putting in dams by taxing them on water in dams, with the
lie "it would have run into our water scheme" and therefore you must pay.

We have never has this major problem before.
Now according to these so called experts, we need an expensive
desalination plant costing more than we would have had to pay, if they
hadn't screwed up in the first place.

The same is happening with our power schemes. They haven't planned or
built anything to expand, which was what usually happened when the
Government used to run the show. instead any profits are swallowed up by
so called investors who brought the infrastructure for a song.
Why do we keep selling out to organisations like this?

It's all about money/greed :-(

Katherine



Why do we keep selling out to organisations like this?

We are voting the wrong people in it seems.
While I am not extremist, I would like to see the greens get their way
with the Tassie pulp mill.
Another corporation pretending to be Tasmanian while really an overseas
business..
I know i used to deal with Gunns, an ordinary hardware and timber store
in Tassie.

jones wrote:
It's all about money/greed :-(

Katherine



Why do we keep selling out to organisations like this?

"Jonno" wrote in message
The powers that be, who put the infrastructure in place, sold our water
utilities, stopped making dams, made water scarce and imported many more
people than we could sustain, created this problem. They even stopped
farmers from putting in dams by taxing them on water in dams, with the lie
"it would have run into our water scheme" and therefore you must pay.

What State are you in Jonno, because paying for dams in not fully applicable
in NSW.

Thats the Victorian state
They even have the hide to charge for run off these days.
Tax them and they wont even know what hit them...Seems to be their
policy...Besides pinching the water from the Goulbourn River, they do
things like that.
We have people being fined huge amounts for minor speed excesses, and
call it speeding...
Now I hear the Casino is cheating at cards by leaving aces out of the
packs due to "human error"

FarmI wrote:
"Jonno" wrote in message
The powers that be, who put the infrastructure in place, sold our water
utilities, stopped making dams, made water scarce and imported many more
people than we could sustain, created this problem. They even stopped
farmers from putting in dams by taxing them on water in dams, with the lie
"it would have run into our water scheme" and therefore you must pay.

What State are you in Jonno, because paying for dams in not fully applicable
in NSW.

On Fri, 05 Oct 2007 13:14:29 +1000, Jonno
wrote:

The powers that be, who put the infrastructure in place, sold our water
utilities, stopped making dams, made water scarce and imported many more
people than we could sustain, created this problem. They even stopped
farmers from putting in dams by taxing them on water in dams, with the
lie "it would have run into our water scheme" and therefore you must pay.

From what I have observed is that WA is the ONLY state in Australia
that has planned ahead uears ago. We have desalination plants and our
dams are now at 43% after the winter rains.

The latest desal plant is bringing in more water than expected with
excess going back into the dams.

Perth is building a second desal plant and other parts of the state
they have desal plants and are building others in other parts of the
state.

If I was the PM I'd forget about the murrey darling basin and build
each state a couple of desal plants whioch are about $350 million
each. Each plant in Perth caters for about 300,000 people.

Perth needs 3 or 4 desal plants and then people can use as much water
as they like


We have never has this major problem before.
Now according to these so called experts, we need an expensive
desalination plant costing more than we would have had to pay, if they
hadn't screwed up in the first place.

All the other states have not planned ahead. Vic to busy upgrading the
MCG to get an extra 10,000 into the ground costing over a $1billion
dollars. They could have built 3 desal plants to cater for over a
million people but they rather have a monument to stupidity than doing
what was required in the first place.

NSW is only just seen the light and their desal plant due to be
finished around 2012 or so. Where they get the water from now is
anyones guess.

All these states stuffing up the hospital and the water system and
building monuments instead of planning ahead.


The same is happening with our power schemes. They haven't planned or
built anything to expand, which was what usually happened when the
Government used to run the show. instead any profits are swallowed up by
so called investors who brought the infrastructure for a song.
Why do we keep selling out to organisations like this?

To pay off ALP debt
The only other way is to raise taxes which no one likes.

Its about time that there was a degree to become a politition.
Too many of them have no idea at all on how to run anything.
The waste that goes on really is incredable.

And these corporations that have directors on multi million dollar
bonuses even in the company is going down the dunny really ought to be
stopped. About time it was capped at $250,000 and no more. Only give
bonus shares oout if these directors turn over a bigger profit, if
they turn over poor profits then they can take a pay cut like everyone
else has to in the real world.

The thing you say that stick out is ALP debt. They spend more than they
can earn?
Surely it is what all the politicians do, they have their palms greased
with money?
That would apply to both parties.
As far as degrees is concerned, these people appear to come from legal
circles, which means they know how to make thing legal, without getting
caught with their fingers in the till, that means dealing with
kickbacks. Somewhere there is a clause in our English background where
legal people were not supposed to be part of the government for that
very thing. Knowing how to subvert the laws. We see examples of it like
Brian Burke, Honest John Bjelke Peterson Various Ex Victorian premiers
etc...
Honest politicians (there are such people!) a conflict in terms, get put
on the backbench when they are found out to be honest. Look at John
Anderson ex deputy prime minister. His comments on speed cameras (ABC)
were not well received and he was removed shortly afterwards.
Desalination plants use too much in the way of green house dependent
power. The only way we can stop the temporary greenhouse gases is to use
nuclear, and No one except the nuclear power station builders are too
keen on the China syndrome type of scene. Chernoble and Japans latest
problem spring to mind. What is powering WA's desalination plants?



jh wrote:
On Fri, 05 Oct 2007 13:14:29 +1000, Jonno
wrote:

The powers that be, who put the infrastructure in place, sold our water
utilities, stopped making dams, made water scarce and imported many more
people than we could sustain, created this problem. They even stopped
farmers from putting in dams by taxing them on water in dams, with the
lie "it would have run into our water scheme" and therefore you must pay.

From what I have observed is that WA is the ONLY state in Australia
that has planned ahead uears ago. We have desalination plants and our
dams are now at 43% after the winter rains.

The latest desal plant is bringing in more water than expected with
excess going back into the dams.

Perth is building a second desal plant and other parts of the state
they have desal plants and are building others in other parts of the
state.

If I was the PM I'd forget about the murrey darling basin and build
each state a couple of desal plants whioch are about $350 million
each. Each plant in Perth caters for about 300,000 people.

Perth needs 3 or 4 desal plants and then people can use as much water
as they like

We have never has this major problem before.
Now according to these so called experts, we need an expensive
desalination plant costing more than we would have had to pay, if they
hadn't screwed up in the first place.

All the other states have not planned ahead. Vic to busy upgrading the
MCG to get an extra 10,000 into the ground costing over a $1billion
dollars. They could have built 3 desal plants to cater for over a
million people but they rather have a monument to stupidity than doing
what was required in the first place.

NSW is only just seen the light and their desal plant due to be
finished around 2012 or so. Where they get the water from now is
anyones guess.

All these states stuffing up the hospital and the water system and
building monuments instead of planning ahead.

The same is happening with our power schemes. They haven't planned or
built anything to expand, which was what usually happened when the
Government used to run the show. instead any profits are swallowed up by
so called investors who brought the infrastructure for a song.
Why do we keep selling out to organisations like this?

To pay off ALP debt
The only other way is to raise taxes which no one likes.

Its about time that there was a degree to become a politition.
Too many of them have no idea at all on how to run anything.
The waste that goes on really is incredable.

And these corporations that have directors on multi million dollar
bonuses even in the company is going down the dunny really ought to be
stopped. About time it was capped at $250,000 and no more. Only give
bonus shares oout if these directors turn over a bigger profit, if
they turn over poor profits then they can take a pay cut like everyone
else has to in the real world.

"Jonno" wrote in message

Somewhere there is a clause in our English background where
legal people were not supposed to be part of the government for that very
thing.

I think you might be thinking of the Doctrine of the Separation of Powers.
This has nothing to do with whether people with a legal background can be
part of government. It just means that the Judicary, the Executive and the
Parliament must all act independently.

Knowing how to subvert the laws. We see examples of it like
Brian Burke, Honest John Bjelke Peterson Various Ex Victorian premiers
etc...

Yeah, well, all to do with Separation of Powers. Joh never even knew the
term and John Howard would know it but has been chopping away at it for
years:
http://www.onlineopinion.com.au/view.asp?article=4630

jh wrote:

If I was the PM I'd forget about the murrey darling basin and build
each state a couple of desal plants whioch are about $350 million
each. Each plant in Perth caters for about 300,000 people.

1) Little John would rather funds parties than build any infrastruture
for Australia. his legacy is going to be the squandering of the good
economic times that PK lined up.

2) Climate change. To power desal, you are going to need a new coal
fired power station. Nukes are not going to happen in my lifetime.

3) Little Johnny's fiddle in the Murray Darling is to shaft the Murray
Darling voters and win votes in marginal city areas. This is why Malcolm
Turnbull is getting shafted atm; he hasn't woken up to it. Little Johnny
doesn't want control of the Murray Darling,because then he would have to
do something. He just wanted to say "well I tried and those nasty nasty
states wouldn't let me"

4) Is this a core promise, non-core core promise, or something else? In
case you've forgotten your bed mate Janet has let the cat out of the bag
with her "promise them anything to get their support and then dump the
idiots" quote.


Now, can we get back to gardening. Please.

Jonno wrote:
The thing you say that stick out is ALP debt.

Well, a country is like a major corporation, it has to borrow to build
major assets. Just like most people borrow to build a home.

Some major companies also have seasonal income and they will borrow in
periods of low income and repay in periods of high income. For
countries,this period can be decades. As far as I'm concerned labour
whilst in power lined up everything for the next decade of "liberal"
prosperity. Kinda ****ed off that that surpkus income wasn't used to get
started on creating major assets like ports, railways, highways, schools
or even hospitals and hospices to look after the people who went through
hards time earlier to give us good times now.

"jh" wrote in message news:470675a2.392796@news-server...

From what I have observed is that WA is the ONLY state in Australia
that has planned ahead uears ago. We have desalination plants and our
dams are now at 43% after the winter rains.

Is that an across the State figure or just the figure for Perth?

If you want to know some of the figures for the Eastern States then you can
check them out here. You might find that Perths water storage is not
brilliant by comparison.
http://www.sca.nsw.gov.au/ Sydney is at 58%
http://waterinfo.nsw.gov.au/sr/StorageSummary.html Country NSW - some
storage is non existent or dire but some is OK
http://www.melbournewater.com.au/con...s.asp?bhcp=1#1
Melbourne is 40%
http://www.seqwater.com.au/content/s...AndMaintenance
SEQ is 21%

The same is happening with our power schemes. They haven't planned or
built anything to expand, which was what usually happened when the
Government used to run the show. instead any profits are swallowed up by
so called investors who brought the infrastructure for a song.
Why do we keep selling out to organisations like this?

To pay off ALP debt

The only other way is to raise taxes which no one likes.

No it's not. One of the ways that we could have improved services right
across the board is if the current Goverment actually decided to DO
something with the huge surplus it is sitting on.

And the really disturbing thing about this surplus is that most Australians
are too tied to one political party to use their heads and actually think.
The surplus the Government is currently sitting on came about as a direct
result of all the economic reforms put in place under the governments of
Hawke and Keating. There is actually no evidence that the Howard government
are "good economic managers". They just keep repeating that line and
Australian voters are stupid enough to believe it. Hawke and Keating and
the current minerals boom should be thanked by Australians for our current
economic "good fortune". I too could be a "good economic manager" if I
didn't buy food or fuel or anything else. My bank account would be huge but
I'd look like a concentration camp survivor, freeze in winter, go nowhere,
see no-one and I'd want to slash my wrists.

I would prefer to stick to gardening, but they are interfering with
honest folks by their actions, even to the point of not being able to
water the garden unless you have a water tank.
Its sad that we are doing so well. I would like to see some of this
"doing so well" as I find at 60 I am on a pension and not doing so well.


Terryc wrote:
Jonno wrote:
The thing you say that stick out is ALP debt.

Well, a country is like a major corporation, it has to borrow to build
major assets. Just like most people borrow to build a home.

Some major companies also have seasonal income and they will borrow in
periods of low income and repay in periods of high income. For
countries,this period can be decades. As far as I'm concerned labour
whilst in power lined up everything for the next decade of "liberal"
prosperity.
If this is the period of prosperity, and we have borrowed up to the
hilt, how in earth are we going to pay it back? When we have no money?

Kinda ****ed off that that surpkus income wasn't used to get
started on creating major assets like ports, railways, highways, schools
or even hospitals and hospices to look after the people who went through
hards time earlier to give us good times now.
I agree old peoples homes here we come.... Er there nothing set up! What
now babyboomers? Build our own?

I agree!
But the problem with political parties is youre either hot one term or
cold the other. I wish there were some swinging polititicans...with the
peoples interset in mind, not mindless selling of government assets to
'merican ans o'seas "investors"

FarmI wrote:
"jh" wrote in message news:470675a2.392796@news-server...

From what I have observed is that WA is the ONLY state in Australia
that has planned ahead uears ago. We have desalination plants and our
dams are now at 43% after the winter rains.

Is that an across the State figure or just the figure for Perth?

If you want to know some of the figures for the Eastern States then you can
check them out here. You might find that Perths water storage is not
brilliant by comparison.
http://www.sca.nsw.gov.au/ Sydney is at 58%
http://waterinfo.nsw.gov.au/sr/StorageSummary.html Country NSW - some
storage is non existent or dire but some is OK
http://www.melbournewater.com.au/con...s.asp?bhcp=1#1
Melbourne is 40%
http://www.seqwater.com.au/content/s...AndMaintenance
SEQ is 21%

The same is happening with our power schemes. They haven't planned or
built anything to expand, which was what usually happened when the
Government used to run the show. instead any profits are swallowed up by
so called investors who brought the infrastructure for a song.
Why do we keep selling out to organisations like this?
To pay off ALP debt

The only other way is to raise taxes which no one likes.

No it's not. One of the ways that we could have improved services right
across the board is if the current Goverment actually decided to DO
something with the huge surplus it is sitting on.

And the really disturbing thing about this surplus is that most Australians
are too tied to one political party to use their heads and actually think.
The surplus the Government is currently sitting on came about as a direct
result of all the economic reforms put in place under the governments of
Hawke and Keating. There is actually no evidence that the Howard government
are "good economic managers". They just keep repeating that line and
Australian voters are stupid enough to believe it. Hawke and Keating and
the current minerals boom should be thanked by Australians for our current
economic "good fortune". I too could be a "good economic manager" if I
didn't buy food or fuel or anything else. My bank account would be huge but
I'd look like a concentration camp survivor, freeze in winter, go nowhere,
see no-one and I'd want to slash my wrists.

"Jonno" wrote in message
...
I agree!
But the problem with political parties is youre either hot one term or
cold the other. I wish there were some swinging polititicans...with the
peoples interset in mind, not mindless selling of government assets to
'merican ans o'seas "investors"

vote green.

which isn't a complete solution of course, but it helps :-) imo the greens
are only a few elections away from becoming a viably large third party
(which, let's face it, is precisely what we need, regardless of who the
third party actually _is_).

the way people currently vote is that many seem to think they "have" to vote
either liberal (sic) or labor, but frankly such behaviour will only
encourage them ;-)
kylie

On Sat, 06 Oct 2007 11:43:18 +1000, Terryc
wrote:

Jonno wrote:
The thing you say that stick out is ALP debt.

Well, a country is like a major corporation, it has to borrow to build
major assets. Just like most people borrow to build a home.

Some major companies also have seasonal income and they will borrow in
periods of low income and repay in periods of high income. For
countries,this period can be decades. As far as I'm concerned labour
whilst in power lined up everything for the next decade of "liberal"
prosperity. Kinda ****ed off that that surpkus income wasn't used to get
started on creating major assets like ports, railways, highways, schools
or even hospitals and hospices to look after the people who went through
hards time earlier to give us good times now.

Water, power, hospitals are the responceability of the states not the
federal government. The ALP here in WA are hopeless like every other
state government across Australia. The reason the libs are not in
power in those states is they keep on picking opposition leaders that
are even worse than what are in power in those states. Its been that
way federally as well for some years.

You say they ought to borrow money to pay for new things, the problem
is they borrow many hundreds of times what they ought to which is why
they run into recessions which are horrible things that do more damage
than anything else. Keating left this country in an awful mess. Its
been restored and debt paid off. With debt paid off they are not
paying oput billions to the banks in interest aloan. This money can
now be spent on other things.

When you build your house you borrow and over 20 years you pay ot off.
Only the tools in this world borrow again and again and again. Once
you pay off your debts you really ought to save for your final years
not continue to spend like there is no tomorrow.

The states are racking in the money from the GST. They are getting
more money now than they've ever had before. Some s illy governments
are spending it on sports stadiums instead of spending it on
infrastructure. Here in WA they are looking to build a new stadium so
that an extra 15,000 people can watch the footy. I rather they build
another two water desalination plants than a stadium to keep 15,000
extra people happy.

Fix the water, hospitals, police, education up first before
squandering it on stadiums and the like.