Hi,
I am wondering whether anyone has any information on parrafin suppliers in the North West - specifically Cumbria area?
I bought a parrafin heater for my greenhouse last week following the warning of a really cold snap and am horrified to see the price of parrafin at my local hardware store - £6 for 4 litres....when the eastimated burn time for a full tank (4 litres) is 18 hours !! I went to B&Q to see if it was cheaper....but not so...and my local heating oil suppliers don't sell it.
I was wondering if there were any garden centres that sell cheaper in bigger quantities....as at that rate I will be bringing the plants into the house next time
Any suggestions please?
Thanks in anticipation....
Gail

On 28/10/2012 10:47, Gailey wrote:
Hi,
I am wondering whether anyone has any information on parrafin suppliers
in the North West - specifically Cumbria area?
I bought a parrafin heater for my greenhouse last week following the
warning of a really cold snap and am horrified to see the price of
parrafin at my local hardware store - £6 for 4 litres....when the
eastimated burn time for a full tank (4 litres) is 18 hours !!

Well, that burn rate would be for a full output of around 2.5kW per
hour. I doubt very much you'd need to sustain that rate for more than a
short time (depending on what temperature you want in the greenhouse,
how cold it is outside, and how well insulated the greenhouse is).

I doubt you'd find it much cheaper than that. Paraffin comes from same
source as petrol and diesel, so will be similar in price to them -
around £1.40 - £1.50 per litre (equivalent around 13 pence per kWh).
Electricity is about 14p per kWh (although only about 6 pence per kWh on
Economy 7 rate, when the temperatures will normally be at their lowest).

So if you can get an electric heater out to your greenhouse, that would
make sense. You would also be able to control the temperature fairly
accurately with a thermostat, which would same money in the long run.

--

Jeff

On 28/10/2012 18:28, Jeff Layman wrote:
On 28/10/2012 10:47, Gailey wrote:
Hi,
I am wondering whether anyone has any information on parrafin suppliers
in the North West - specifically Cumbria area?
I bought a parrafin heater for my greenhouse last week following the
warning of a really cold snap and am horrified to see the price of
parrafin at my local hardware store - £6 for 4 litres....when the
eastimated burn time for a full tank (4 litres) is 18 hours !!

Well, that burn rate would be for a full output of around 2.5kW per
hour. I doubt very much you'd need to sustain that rate for more than a
short time (depending on what temperature you want in the greenhouse,
how cold it is outside, and how well insulated the greenhouse is).

I doubt you'd find it much cheaper than that. Paraffin comes from same
source as petrol and diesel, so will be similar in price to them -
around £1.40 - £1.50 per litre (equivalent around 13 pence per kWh).
Electricity is about 14p per kWh (although only about 6 pence per kWh on
Economy 7 rate, when the temperatures will normally be at their lowest).

So if you can get an electric heater out to your greenhouse, that would
make sense. You would also be able to control the temperature fairly
accurately with a thermostat, which would same money in the long run.

If you are going to look at alternatives then you can also get LPG gas
heaters with non electric thermostats that will run on gas from the big
Red cylinders, with these no chance of loosing heat in the night with a
power cut.
I have found these people to be good on price and service.
http://www.greenhousepeople.co.uk/ac...s/gas-heaters/

Also you are putting co2 into the greenhouse that will give you improved
crops.
http://homeharvest.com/carbondioxideenrichment.htm
David @ the damp end of Swansea Bay

On 28/10/2012 18:28, Jeff Layman wrote:
On 28/10/2012 10:47, Gailey wrote:
Hi,
I am wondering whether anyone has any information on parrafin suppliers
in the North West - specifically Cumbria area?
I bought a parrafin heater for my greenhouse last week following the
warning of a really cold snap and am horrified to see the price of
parrafin at my local hardware store - £6 for 4 litres....when the
eastimated burn time for a full tank (4 litres) is 18 hours !!

Well, that burn rate would be for a full output of around 2.5kW per
hour. I doubt very much you'd need to sustain that rate for more than a
short time (depending on what temperature you want in the greenhouse,
how cold it is outside, and how well insulated the greenhouse is).

I doubt you'd find it much cheaper than that. Paraffin comes from same
source as petrol and diesel, so will be similar in price to them -
around £1.40 - £1.50 per litre (equivalent around 13 pence per kWh).
Electricity is about 14p per kWh (although only about 6 pence per kWh on
Economy 7 rate, when the temperatures will normally be at their lowest).

So if you can get an electric heater out to your greenhouse, that would
make sense. You would also be able to control the temperature fairly
accurately with a thermostat, which would same money in the long run.

I should have said about Paraffin, it is sold as "Kerosene" or heating
oil, but Beware of it, the sulphur content can be higher than the "Lamp
oil" paraffin.
As the heater isn't vented this sulphur goes into the air in the
greenhouse and can prove deadly to plants.
David @ the damp end of Swansea Bay

On Sun, 28 Oct 2012 10:47:00 +0000, Gailey wrote:

... and my local heating oil suppliers don't sell it.

Well perhaps not BS2869 Class C1 but 28 sec heating oil (BS2869 Class C2)
is only marginally heavier. 28 sec heating oil will still work just might
be a bit smelly compared to "paraffin" produced for non-flued heaters.
The sulphur content of heating oil is higher but I doubt that is
particularly significant.

Heating oil is around 60p/l, minimum delivery from a heating oil supplier
is probably 500l though. You might be able to buy a smaller quantity if
you collect or find a neighbour with oil fired central heating?

--
Cheers
Dave.

On Sun, 28 Oct 2012 18:28:57 +0000, Jeff Layman wrote:

Paraffin comes from same source as petrol and diesel, so will be
similar in price to them - around £1.40 - £1.50 per litre

But nearly 60p of that is road fuel duty, the base oil cost and profits
for the supply chain on road fuel costing £1.40 at the pump is around
55p... (28p VAT, 58p Duty). Hence heating oil being about 60p/l
delivered.

Electricity is about 14p per kWh (although only about 6 pence per kWh
on Economy 7 rate, ...

You need to find a better tariff, I pay 9.04p/unit but that isn't E7.

The E7 is 17.41/5.8 but that has *no* other charges and all units are at
that rate. If we used much from the E7 supply I'd shop around for a
better tariff. I'd expect to knock a good 4p of the peak rate and a
couple of p off the off peak.

If the OP does have E7 then using that rather than oil even at 60p/l may
well be the cheapest option. But a good value normal tariff would be more
expensive than oil at 60p/l but not at garden centre paraffin prices...

--
Cheers
Dave.

On Sun, 28 Oct 2012 19:30:56 +0000, David Hill wrote:

If you are going to look at alternatives then you can also get LPG gas
heaters with non electric thermostats that will run on gas from the
big Red cylinders,

For use outside make sure the heater will run on propane from red
cylinders. Butane (blue cylinders) won't vapourise once the cylinder temp
gets down to near freezing...

Also you are putting co2 into the greenhouse that will give you
improved crops.

And from oil, as well as water. Each kg of gas burnt produces around a kg
of water, I suspect oil will be similar.

Interesting you comment about sulphur and deadly to plants. TBH I don't
know but I do have vauge recollections of a dicussion in the last year or
so in here about that. I don't think it came to a firm conclusion though.

--
Cheers
Dave.

On 28/10/2012 19:52, Dave Liquorice wrote:
On Sun, 28 Oct 2012 10:47:00 +0000, Gailey wrote:

... and my local heating oil suppliers don't sell it.

Well perhaps not BS2869 Class C1 but 28 sec heating oil (BS2869 Class C2)
is only marginally heavier. 28 sec heating oil will still work just might
be a bit smelly compared to "paraffin" produced for non-flued heaters.
The sulphur content of heating oil is higher but I doubt that is
particularly significant.

It is very risky, and in my opinion not worth the risk.

Heating oil is around 60p/l, minimum delivery from a heating oil supplier
is probably 500l though. You might be able to buy a smaller quantity if
you collect or find a neighbour with oil fired central heating?

I wouldn't touch heating oil with a barge pole.
I've seen a crop of over 2000 tomato plants wiped out overnight when a
flue blocked and the fume from a heater filled the glasshouse.
Another time a cucumber crop lost the same way, Sulphur burns the
foliage of the plants, some are a little more tolerant than others.
We used to clean out glasshouses by burning piles of sulphur and
Nicotine shreds in closed down houses then leaving them for 24 hours.
(Sacha. I expect Ray remembers doing this)
David @ the wet end of Swansea Bay

On 28/10/2012 20:16, Dave Liquorice wrote:
On Sun, 28 Oct 2012 19:30:56 +0000, David Hill wrote:

If you are going to look at alternatives then you can also get LPG gas
heaters with non electric thermostats that will run on gas from the
big Red cylinders,

For use outside make sure the heater will run on propane from red
cylinders. Butane (blue cylinders) won't vapourise once the cylinder temp
gets down to near freezing...

Also you are putting co2 into the greenhouse that will give you
improved crops.

And from oil, as well as water. Each kg of gas burnt produces around a kg
of water, I suspect oil will be similar.

Interesting you comment about sulphur and deadly to plants. TBH I don't
know but I do have vauge recollections of a dicussion in the last year or
so in here about that. I don't think it came to a firm conclusion though.

The heaters on the site I put a link to are all designed to run on Propane.
That's why I said "Red cylinders"

Thanks for the replies.

Unfortunately, I don't yet have an electricity supply to my greenhouse, which is a job planned for next year to coincide with electric to power my pond pump. Both are a decent distance from the house so a temp hookup isnt really practical - which is why I bought the parrafin heater.
I think if I were to change and buy a gas burner the additional cost would outweight the saving in fuel initially - so what I need to find is a cheaper or more efficient way of running the machine I have bought. It is a big heater but my greenhouse is 10x 12.... It says in the manual that the burn time is 18 hours. We tried to have it as low as possible on Fri night, but it was still almost empty by morning, though I guess as it is new the wick will take a bit up before it gets started.
I have researched using kerosene as we have oil CH but decided against it for the safety of my plants (and me!).
I was reading of a place near Manchester that did a self fill parrafin supply into containers , and hoping there might be something like that in our area?

In article , says...

Thanks for the replies.

Unfortunately, I don't yet have an electricity supply to my greenhouse,
which is a job planned for next year to coincide with electric to power
my pond pump. Both are a decent distance from the house so a temp hookup
isnt really practical - which is why I bought the parrafin heater.
I think if I were to change and buy a gas burner the additional cost
would outweight the saving in fuel initially - so what I need to find is
a cheaper or more efficient way of running the machine I have bought. It
is a big heater but my greenhouse is 10x 12....

I'm curious what you need to heat the whole GH for at this time of year?

Before you buy anything else I'd invest in a cheap max-min thermometer and keep a record of
the natural temp variation in different parts of your GH.

To frost protect small cuttings or seedlings I used to put a plastic-sheet tent over
susceptible plants,on a section of slatted staging in the least-cold area of the GH, and use
8-hour night lights under it on frosty nights.I had bubble insulation to spread over the tent
at night. The heat from the TL rises and is trapped.

If you have any outdoor cold frames, use them inside the GH in winter; instant double
glazing for plants. I've even been known to burn a tealight in outdoor frames at night.
Cheapest TL's by the bag from IKEA.


Janet

On Sun, 28 Oct 2012 10:47:00 +0000, Gailey
wrote:


Hi,
I am wondering whether anyone has any information on parrafin suppliers
in the North West - specifically Cumbria area?
I bought a parrafin heater for my greenhouse last week following the
warning of a really cold snap and am horrified to see the price of
parrafin at my local hardware store - £6 for 4 litres....when the
eastimated burn time for a full tank (4 litres) is 18 hours !! I went to
B&Q to see if it was cheaper....but not so...and my local heating oil
suppliers don't sell it.
I was wondering if there were any garden centres that sell cheaper in
bigger quantities....as at that rate I will be bringing the plants into
the house next time
Any suggestions please?
Thanks in anticipation....
Gail


Can you take someone old on a Wednesday and get a discount?

What about any local hardware shops?
--
http://www.voucherfreebies.co.uk

On Sun, 28 Oct 2012 21:03:57 +0000, David Hill wrote:

I wouldn't touch heating oil with a barge pole.
I've seen a crop of over 2000 tomato plants wiped out overnight when a
flue blocked and the fume from a heater filled the glasshouse.
Another time a cucumber crop lost the same way, Sulphur burns the
foliage of the plants, some are a little more tolerant than others.

Fairy Nuff... presumably a commercial sized greenhouse and a hefty heater
to produce an out of season crop though rather than "just keeping the
frost out".

We used to clean out glasshouses by burning piles of sulphur and
Nicotine shreds in closed down houses then leaving them for 24 hours.

That's some what more concentrated than the fumes from a few litres of
oil. B-) But yes, as a fumigation (insects?) it was certainly used.

So if heating oil is out we need to find a source of BS2869 Class C1 oil.
I guess one place to start is looking for contact information on the
expensive containers in the garden centres.

The main oil distribution depot for Cumbria is the BP Depot at Dalston,
supplied by rail from the Grangemouth refinery. I think all the local
suppliers probably get their oil from there. try contact the depot direct
to see if they actually have BS2869 Class C1 oil, they probably won't
sell direct but should be able to put you in contact with a "retailer".

I wonder if the "premium" 28sec heating oil that costs a couple of p more
per litre than "regular" 28sec heating oil is actually BS2869 Class C1.
It's supposed to burn cleaner and produce less gunk in your boiler.

--
Cheers
Dave.

On 30/10/2012 14:18, Dave Liquorice wrote:
On Sun, 28 Oct 2012 21:03:57 +0000, David Hill wrote:

I wouldn't touch heating oil with a barge pole.
I've seen a crop of over 2000 tomato plants wiped out overnight when a
flue blocked and the fume from a heater filled the glasshouse.
Another time a cucumber crop lost the same way, Sulphur burns the
foliage of the plants, some are a little more tolerant than others.

Fairy Nuff... presumably a commercial sized greenhouse and a hefty heater
to produce an out of season crop though rather than "just keeping the
frost out".

It was a house of tomatoes planted at the end of March and being given
heat for the first few weeks, and this happened over night.

Can you take someone old on a Wednesday and get a discount?

What about any local hardware shops?

Less of the "Someone OLD"