Jim Webster wrote:

wrote in message
...


Jim Webster wrote:

wrote in message
...

Independent on Sunday (London)
March 30, 2003
INSECTS THRIVE ON GM 'PEST-KILLING' CROPS
BY GEOFFREY LEAN ENVIRONMENT EDITOR


rather makes a mess of the claims that GM crops were a threat to all
those
butterflies doesn't it

...

most insects targets of pesticides are more resistant to the same
pesticides than those that are not targets.

and the evidence for this rather broad statement is?

Jim Webster

my broad statement was preceded by the word "most"

try google using "beneficial insects" "pesticide application" "effects on"

Any integrated pest management user knows that pesticides and
beneficial insects are not very compatible. Of course, some pesticides
are less toxic to some particular beneficial insects. But it is not
difficult to understand that beneficial insects get the triple wammy
of pesticide effect, lack of available insects to prey or to parasite and
the little prey the find is poisoned.

Here are some links kind of at random:
http://www.entomology.wisc.edu/mbcn/fea202.html
http://www.fuzzylu.com/greencenter/q25/aphid.htm
....
and many more

wrote in message
...


Jim Webster wrote:

wrote in message
...


Jim Webster wrote:

wrote in message
...

Independent on Sunday (London)
March 30, 2003
INSECTS THRIVE ON GM 'PEST-KILLING' CROPS
BY GEOFFREY LEAN ENVIRONMENT EDITOR


rather makes a mess of the claims that GM crops were a threat to all
those
butterflies doesn't it

...

most insects targets of pesticides are more resistant to the same
pesticides than those that are not targets.

and the evidence for this rather broad statement is?

Jim Webster

my broad statement was preceded by the word "most"

try google using "beneficial insects" "pesticide application" "effects on"

Any integrated pest management user knows that pesticides and
beneficial insects are not very compatible.

exactly, but your argument is as much in support of GM with its lesser
pesticide use as it is against GM. Remember the alternative to GM is not
organic but other conventional

Jim Webster

wrote in message
...


Jim Webster wrote:

wrote in message
...


Jim Webster wrote:

wrote in message
...

Independent on Sunday (London)
March 30, 2003
INSECTS THRIVE ON GM 'PEST-KILLING' CROPS
BY GEOFFREY LEAN ENVIRONMENT EDITOR


rather makes a mess of the claims that GM crops were a threat to all
those
butterflies doesn't it

...

most insects targets of pesticides are more resistant to the same
pesticides than those that are not targets.

and the evidence for this rather broad statement is?

Jim Webster

my broad statement was preceded by the word "most"

try google using "beneficial insects" "pesticide application" "effects on"

Any integrated pest management user knows that pesticides and
beneficial insects are not very compatible.

exactly, but your argument is as much in support of GM with its lesser
pesticide use as it is against GM. Remember the alternative to GM is not
organic but other conventional

Jim Webster

Jim Webster writes

Someone
Any integrated pest management user knows that pesticides and
beneficial insects are not very compatible.

exactly, but your argument is as much in support of GM with its lesser
pesticide use as it is against GM. Remember the alternative to GM is not
organic but other conventional

Actually pesticides are pretty useful for integrated pest management.
If you can take out the incoming pest's first generation in the field
then typically they will breed in the field margins, along with their
predators. Sometimes that is enough to ensure a good population of
predators entering the crop at the same time as the second generation of
pests. Damage is thus reduced to the level you don't have to worry about
it.

That's typically why aphids in UK cereals only need autumn, or perhaps
autumn+very-early-spring aphicides in most years (in practice pretty
well every year).

--
Oz
This post is worth absolutely nothing and is probably fallacious.
Note: soon (maybe already) only posts via despammed.com will be accepted.

Jim Webster wrote:

wrote in message
...

Independent on Sunday (London)
March 30, 2003
INSECTS THRIVE ON GM 'PEST-KILLING' CROPS
BY GEOFFREY LEAN ENVIRONMENT EDITOR


rather makes a mess of the claims that GM crops were a threat to all those
butterflies doesn't it

....

most insects targets of pesticides are more resistant to the same
pesticides than those that are not targets.

wrote in message
...


Jim Webster wrote:

wrote in message
...

Independent on Sunday (London)
March 30, 2003
INSECTS THRIVE ON GM 'PEST-KILLING' CROPS
BY GEOFFREY LEAN ENVIRONMENT EDITOR


rather makes a mess of the claims that GM crops were a threat to all
those
butterflies doesn't it

...

most insects targets of pesticides are more resistant to the same
pesticides than those that are not targets.

and the evidence for this rather broad statement is?

Jim Webster

Jim Webster wrote:

wrote in message
...


Jim Webster wrote:

wrote in message
...

Independent on Sunday (London)
March 30, 2003
INSECTS THRIVE ON GM 'PEST-KILLING' CROPS
BY GEOFFREY LEAN ENVIRONMENT EDITOR


rather makes a mess of the claims that GM crops were a threat to all
those
butterflies doesn't it

...

most insects targets of pesticides are more resistant to the same
pesticides than those that are not targets.

and the evidence for this rather broad statement is?

Jim Webster

my broad statement was preceded by the word "most"

try google using "beneficial insects" "pesticide application" "effects on"

Any integrated pest management user knows that pesticides and
beneficial insects are not very compatible. Of course, some pesticides
are less toxic to some particular beneficial insects. But it is not
difficult to understand that beneficial insects get the triple wammy
of pesticide effect, lack of available insects to prey or to parasite and
the little prey the find is poisoned.

Here are some links kind of at random:
http://www.entomology.wisc.edu/mbcn/fea202.html
http://www.fuzzylu.com/greencenter/q25/aphid.htm
....
and many more

wrote in message
...


Jim Webster wrote:

wrote in message
...


Jim Webster wrote:

wrote in message
...

Independent on Sunday (London)
March 30, 2003
INSECTS THRIVE ON GM 'PEST-KILLING' CROPS
BY GEOFFREY LEAN ENVIRONMENT EDITOR


rather makes a mess of the claims that GM crops were a threat to all
those
butterflies doesn't it

...

most insects targets of pesticides are more resistant to the same
pesticides than those that are not targets.

and the evidence for this rather broad statement is?

Jim Webster

my broad statement was preceded by the word "most"

try google using "beneficial insects" "pesticide application" "effects on"

Any integrated pest management user knows that pesticides and
beneficial insects are not very compatible.

exactly, but your argument is as much in support of GM with its lesser
pesticide use as it is against GM. Remember the alternative to GM is not
organic but other conventional

Jim Webster

wrote in message
...


Jim Webster wrote:

wrote in message
...


Jim Webster wrote:

wrote in message
...

Independent on Sunday (London)
March 30, 2003
INSECTS THRIVE ON GM 'PEST-KILLING' CROPS
BY GEOFFREY LEAN ENVIRONMENT EDITOR


rather makes a mess of the claims that GM crops were a threat to all
those
butterflies doesn't it

...

most insects targets of pesticides are more resistant to the same
pesticides than those that are not targets.

and the evidence for this rather broad statement is?

Jim Webster

my broad statement was preceded by the word "most"

try google using "beneficial insects" "pesticide application" "effects on"

Any integrated pest management user knows that pesticides and
beneficial insects are not very compatible.

exactly, but your argument is as much in support of GM with its lesser
pesticide use as it is against GM. Remember the alternative to GM is not
organic but other conventional

Jim Webster

Jim Webster writes

Someone
Any integrated pest management user knows that pesticides and
beneficial insects are not very compatible.

exactly, but your argument is as much in support of GM with its lesser
pesticide use as it is against GM. Remember the alternative to GM is not
organic but other conventional

Actually pesticides are pretty useful for integrated pest management.
If you can take out the incoming pest's first generation in the field
then typically they will breed in the field margins, along with their
predators. Sometimes that is enough to ensure a good population of
predators entering the crop at the same time as the second generation of
pests. Damage is thus reduced to the level you don't have to worry about
it.

That's typically why aphids in UK cereals only need autumn, or perhaps
autumn+very-early-spring aphicides in most years (in practice pretty
well every year).

--
Oz
This post is worth absolutely nothing and is probably fallacious.
Note: soon (maybe already) only posts via despammed.com will be accepted.